Ignoring manually entering steps decision will force once dedicated FitBit users to Apple Watch

[KurtSanders]

This is a horrible decision by FitBit Management!  I now have an Apple Watch to read & send mail, Read & send messages, control my garage doors, thermostats, view my calendar, answer phone calls, etc.  These are robust features that a FitBit device cannot perform.  As a result, I have stopped using my FitBit Surge in favor of the Apple Watch.  I  am not sure why FitBit Management decided to ignore my manually entered steps since my FitBit Friends community, I actively participate with, has asked why my 7 day steps are decreasing.  I have told them that the Apple Watch is now my primary device and that manually entering steps is IGNORED because FitBit Management thinks I will falsely inflate my daily steps, an opinion that is ridiculous among true sports minded people. After all, if I wanted to do that, I would place my FitBit on a fan blade and let it spin all day long, or employ other cheating means.  My friends would detect higher numbers right away and quickly discount my 7 day totals.  SO CHEATING DOES NOT WORK with FitBit Friends.  

I am replacing my FitBit with the Apple Watch as I did with with my Apple iPhone which replaced my Blackberry years ago.  If FitBit kept my manually entered steps on the 7 days average by allowing syncing of Apple Health steps with FitBit, I could see promoting both Apple and FitBit devices.  IGNORING MANUALLY ENTERED STEPS IS A POOR DECISION BY FITBIT TO IGNORE MANUALLY ENTERED STEPS FROM 7 DAY AVERAGE.  Fitbit, once a activity tracking leader, ignored their dedicated community and will eventually fade away, like Blackberry, Palm Pilot, Compaq Computers, Digital Equipment Co, RadioShack....

[PureEvil]

@KurtSanders,

Welcome to the community!

I assume your mind is made up, so this is not necessarily a response to you.  This is a response to other folks that may be reading this thread so that they have the appropriate context.

Fitbit does count manually entered steps.  They count it on your dashboard and they even count it on your friends leaderboard.  This is a screenshot of my entry on that leaderboard two minutes apart:

So unless you think that I've managed to get 4500+ steps in two minutes (I don't run a one minute mile), you can trust that I manually entered a 2 mile walk for earlier in the day.  So manually entered steps are not ignored from your 7 day average like you claimed, I have the screenshots to prove it.

There are two exceptions to this rule, which is what I assume you're referring to:

• Manually entered steps do not count towards badges.
• Manually entered steps do not count towards challenges.

I assume that your issue is with the second one.  I actually agree with the Fitbit policy.

While I agree that on some level, we all can, and perhaps should, be honest about our activity...  I think the temptation is much too high.

I agree with you that if you post absurdly high numbers, your friends will notice almost immediately.  However, I've seen instances like this...

You and your friend Sally are always in Workweek Hustle challenges together and she always seems to win.  However, it looks like this week is your week (family vacation at Disney) and you entered Friday with a 15k step lead; you're doing great.  You didn't know, however, that Sally is running in a 10k this afternoon.  So at 11pm tonight, you're at the hotel watching your kids... and find that Sally landed 1500 steps ahead of you.  You can't leave (and abandon your kids), but you're also miffed that you were passed with one hour to spare.  Surely no one would suspect that the difference between your natural 102k steps and the inflated 104k steps were due to manually entered activities?  ...but then again, what's stopping Sally from doing the same?

Strangely enough, I think folks are more likely to manually enter steps to avoid being last in the challenge rather than to land first in the challenge.

A number of years ago (started with January 2014), I sent out a challenge to my teammates...  If anyone catches me not making my 10k steps any day that year, they get an Amazon gift card.  I've renewed that challenge every year.  During the nearly four years, I've missed precisely one day (9505 steps, 495 steps short).  I never manually enter activities, on that day I was very tempted.

I've read enough posts here in the forum to know that people will game the system whichever way they can.  I've seen posts from folks who avoid syncing because they want to hide their steps during a challenge and are miffed because their neighbor's computer will sync their tracker without their consent or control.

While it's true that you may attach your Fitbit to a fan to get your steps, it still takes a certain amount of initiative and coordination...  Additionally it takes time to accumulate these steps (even if falsely).  The difference between 1000 and 10000 manually entered steps is one keystroke, and the effect is instantaneous.

Just my 2¢.

[KurtSanders]

I understand that FitBit Inc. thinks that they should be the authenticator of "real" steps, but we all know that the Fitbit devices only counts movement as "steps", whether that is actually walking/running or if you want to move you hand up and down while on the couch to add a significant amount of steps. 

Many FitBit people, including myself, actually complain {strongly} that they perform other exercise activities, like biking, in which the "device" does not accurately track "steps" and therefore would like to add them.  I wouldn't mind if these were "flagged" but still counted if you dis-believe your FitBit friends, which I do not, as social exercising has some form of Trust, like when your device goes dead on a marathon, and you would like to add back in the steps/miles that did not get recorded.

If I thought that their was someone out there that wanted to win so bad as to cheat by adding steps, then one has to consider their friendship for social exercising.  I have over 30 friends that are on the honor system for tracking their exercises, and trust me, if someone in the group wants to win at all costs, that is more regulated by the group than to restrict all the real FitBit users who want to record "steps" for exercises that did not recorded for some reason.

Needless to say, I like that you took time to explain your opinion and support of FitBit Inc in their direction.  Unfortunately,  more than 50% of my FitBit exercising group has moved to Apple for iPhone and Watches and have removed FitBit because of the inability to have a common desktop where "steps" of friends can be shown.

Apple Health is a far cry from FitBit's dashboard, but in the end, IMHO, it will slowly loose marketshare because they did not listen to their base for features that we need to stay with their platform.  

If anyone out there is part of the Apple ecosystem (iPhone, iPad, Watch, etc), the FitBit is similar to a black and white TV while Apple is the 4K color flat screen.

[PureEvil]

@KurtSanders,

That's not really a fair characterization.  Let's be explicitly clear about this, you're taking exception to how Fitbit counts steps in challenges.  It does not affect your dashboard and it does not affect your leaderboard.  At least concede that point.

You're right, Fitbit devices counts movements as "steps" and that can be gamed.  You can move your hand up and down while watching television.  No debate.  This is a screenshot from one of the Workweek Hustle challenges I'm in this week:

Go ahead, with less than three hours left in the challenge, make up the remaining 53943 steps by waving your hand up and down endlessly.  You know how long it takes by adding a manual activity?

55000<enter>

Six keystrokes.

You also state that people, including yourself, have complained that Fitbit does not account for other activities and is mostly focused around steps and that's how the challenges are structured.  That's a fair assessment, although I'll point out that you can log (and auto-detect) a great wealth of different activities.  Again, what you take exception with is how these are counted in challenges.

However, from my observation, this is your second(?) post on the forums (and your first post was effectively 'goodbye'), so if you've complained, it's not in a place that it's visible at least to me.  I think your idea of allowing manual activities (as a non-default option) as well as marking folks with manual activities has merit, but you've also not posted that as a feature suggestion.

While I think that it's endearing (I know that sounds condescending, but really it's not) that among your group of friends you can all collectively trust each other, I think you underestimate the temptation of the average Fitbit user.  Fitbit allows you to enter activities and keep them (on your dashboard and your leaderboard).

That said, if Fitbit allows folks to compete in a challenge against other folks, I think it's only fair to set up some ground rules for the sake of etiquette.  Fitbit challenges are public; you may be able to control who you invite, but you can't control who they invite.  Or if I may frame it another way, if you have your own pool feel free to do what you want in it.  However, having some rules of etiquette in public pools (no urinating, no skinny dipping, etc.) is reasonable for most people...  The most good for the most people.

I don't own any Apple products, so I can't say conclusively about what is available, but I was under the impression that you were not able to set up challenges under their health system (compare to friends perhaps, but not challenges per se).  If that's the case, I find it a bit ironic that you'd leave a platform for a lack of options for challenges, only to move to a platform that doesn't do challenges at all.  Again, Fitbit credits you for manually entered activities on your dashboard, and even on your friends leaderboard.

Finally, comparing new Apple Watch to the Surge (released in 2014), it's like comparing an iPhone 8 to an iPhone 5S.

[LanuzaFitbit]

Welcome to the Community @KurtSanders. Hello @PureEvil, thanks for chiming in.

I'd like to thank you both for keeping this discussion civil and not spiraling down into name-calling. @KurtSanders in addition to what @PureEvil mentioned, in the past there were cases of harassment being caused by users with lots and lots of steps that were mostly manually logged. They would log lots of steps and then offer 'help' to other users.

Nevertheless, thanks for bringing your point up. Please do know that we take all comments seriously and that we're constantly looking for ways to improve. If you have the chance to go through the feature suggestions board that @PureEvil mentioned, perhaps you can see some suggestions that you'd like to support.

Feel free to reach out to me with any questions, I'll be happy to answer.

[ziplock9000]

Can we confirm that manually entered steps don't count towards challenges?

I have a step machine and it does not register on my fitbit, so I have to manually enter them by estimating an actual walking session.

While my steps do increase, it seems they don't register for challenges.