Over excercising

[DominicJ]

So, Ive been off work this week, and I've been walking a bit more than normal, and snacking a bit less than normal.

On MFP, as of now I am

Goal 1500

Food 2222

Excercise 1695

Remaining 973

I'm not hungry, and I'm going for another walk later

Now a 2000cal def is extreme to say the least, is there any flex, can I keep this up for a few days for a bit of a boost or is it just all in all a bad idea?

[SunsetRunner]

What is your height and weight? What exercise do you normally do, and what do you normally eat?

[DominicJ]

5ft 6

172lbs, roughly 120lbs of that LBM

Walking, Running, some circuit stuff

Yesterday was omlette, protein shakes, burger & chips (Its healthier than it sounds)

Today, protein shakes, couple of lean pork steaks, probably burger and chips again for tea

[Bjorn]

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@DominicJ wrote:

I'm not hungry, and I'm going for another walk later

Now a 2000cal def is extreme to say the least, is there any flex, can I keep this up for a few days for a bit of a boost or is it just all in all a bad idea?

---

I am probably not the best person to answer this, but I can give you anecdotal information. I have no citations for it or anything, so, don't take what I say as any kind of science lol...

2000 deficit is going to hurt you, 1000 deficit is already rough enough.

Yesterday, I realized I needed to add more protein to my diet. I read somewhere (without checking citations myself, cuz you know, aint got time for that...) 1 gram of protein per pound of your current weight is what a person on a calorie deficit while engaging exercise should have per day, which means a lot of protein supplements. I've also relaxed my deficit from 1000 to 500. Today, and I was able to maintain close to 40 minutes of cardio on my walk home today. Just the day before, while in 1000 deficit, I could only mix in about 20 minutes per walking session, but two sessions a day.

this could also be due to the fact that I had to indulge in some serious carb and sugar treats to get those last couple of calories closer to meeting my deficit.

[SunsetRunner]

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@DominicJ wrote:

5ft 6

172lbs, roughly 120lbs of that LBM

Walking, Running, some circuit stuff

Yesterday was omlette, protein shakes, burger & chips (Its healthier than it sounds)

Today, protein shakes, couple of lean pork steaks, probably burger and chips again for tea

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You're not going to agree with me, because you have some (already stated) notions.

Using an accepted formula (I learned this in human physiology in university) for males,

(4 times height in inches) less 128. This is for aerobic athletes with 5% to 10% body fat.

Your calculation results in 136 lb., and assuming a 10% body fat (at that weight), your

Lean Body Mass would be 122.4 lb. So far, no problems - now the part you don't like.

To lose the weight, you need to drastically change your diet. You have an atrociously

high intake of unhealthy fats/cholesterol and an excessive intake of unhealthy proteins.

Success will come from primarily complex carbohydrates (grains, tubers, vegetables of

colorful kind) along with moderate amount of meat/day (size of the palm of your hand).

Exercise (for weight loss) should be aerobic (walking, jogging, running) at a speed that

suits you, progressively increasing distance (and speed a bit) to a level that you like.

[josephz2va]

Most foods you can consume instead of protein supplements. Whey protein is more costly than consuming foods. From $25 per 2 weeks to $100 per 2 weeks depending on who is selling it.

I consume as extras:

2 Light & Fit Greek Yogurts 80 cals 12Gs of Protein each - 24Gs of protein.

Egg Whites or Egg Beaters - 15 cals 5Gs of protein per 3 tablespoons. 16 tablespoons is 1 cup in pyrex measurement you can fry in a pan. That's 25Gs of protein.

[DominicJ]

"2000 deficit is going to hurt you, 1000 deficit is already rough enough."

My question is is there any flex on that.

"You're not going to agree with me, because you have some (already stated) notions."

My problem with your opinions is you tend not to answer the question actually asked, 

"Most foods you can consume instead of protein supplements. Whey protein is more costly than consuming foods. From $25 per 2 weeks to $100 per 2 weeks depending on who is selling it."

I bulk buy and get it for less per gram of protein than I pay for greek yoghurt

[kaboomcanuck]

I'm just going to add this you can take it if you want or ignore me all together but YOU NEED MORE FRUIT AND VEGETABLES!. From your description of what you're eating its meat and potatoes. You can survive on a 2000 calorie deficit if you're still getting your needed nutrients. Your meat and potatoes are quickly going to run up the numbers of calories consumed; but not the number of nutrients consumed. I'm not you so I can't comment on what works or what doesn't but I can say with more fruits and vegetables you will reach your goal faster and feel much better.

As for the protein shake you can take it or leave it. I think you get enough protein from what you eat and any extra is just going to waste. Unless you're working out like a professional athlete it isn't going to help much in my opinion. That being said I tend to eat foods higher in protein when I'm doing higher intensity exercise (like quinoa\oatmeal\eggs\nuts) instead of taking any kind of supplement. On occasion when I'm in a hurry however with nothing premade I will eat a protein bar.

[SunsetRunner]

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@DominicJ wrote:

"2000 deficit is going to hurt you, 1000 deficit is already rough enough."

My question is is there any flex on that.

"You're not going to agree with me, because you have some (already stated) notions."

My problem with your opinions is you tend not to answer the question actually asked, 

"Most foods you can consume instead of protein supplements. Whey protein is more costly than consuming foods. From $25 per 2 weeks to $100 per 2 weeks depending on who is selling it."

I bulk buy and get it for less per gram of protein than I pay for greek yoghurt

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OK, one more try, just because I like you

Short Answer (one you may like):

There is absolutely no problem with going 2,000 cal. short (but there are conditions).

Longer Answer (one that you likely will not like, these are the conditions):

As long as you eat the calories that are needed for your "ideal" weight, then you will

be fine, and you will lose the 36 lb. you don't need. Your "ideal" weight is 136 lb. (as

noted above), and that takes 1,520 cal./day., but that's high nutrient calories, and not

the high cholesterol/fat/protein stuff you are eating now (see my prior answer above),

and you can add some proper nutrition (extra calories) for exercise that you're doing.

Hope this will help you get a "bit" more "fit"

[Bjorn]

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@DominicJ wrote:

My question is is there any flex on that.

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I'm going to give you a Heybales quote to reply to this, because this is one of the things I hold onto when I'm thinking of letting my deficit get too big per day:

"Reasonable deficit can help protect muscle mass loss.

Unreasonable encourages it. "

When I'm looking at my weekly deficit, and I'm at a 500 calorie deficit, I know by the end of the week I need to have -3500 calories. When I look at my weekly deficit on a week where I've not eaten enough calories, I may have -4000 or -4100 or so -  so I may eat a little more on one day to get closer to -3500.

Again, I will remind you, I'm not a scientist, and I have no formal training or biological knowledge, but I can only tell you this is what has worked for me so far. I hope this helps 🙂

[DominicJ]

"Longer Answer (one that you likely will not like, these are the conditions):

As long as you eat the calories that are needed for your "ideal" weight, then you will

be fine, and you will lose the 36 lb. you don't need. Your "ideal" weight is 136 lb. (as

noted above), and that takes 1,520 cal./day., but that's high nutrient calories, and not

the high cholesterol/fat/protein stuff you are eating now (see my prior answer above),

and you can add some proper nutrition (extra calories) for exercise that you're doing."

That actually makes a certain amount of sense, thank you.

If we ignore the calories and "nutrition" confusion.

*Note

This isnt my normal diet, she who must be obeyed is on holiday

[Heybales]

I'll also suggest it depends how the increased TDEE came about that is allowing for such a huge deficit.

I'll use my own example, when I lost my last 10 lbs to goal weight. A specific method I used. And one event in there.

If you went backpacking all day long and burned say 6000 calories, making your TDEE 8000 calories - then 2000 calorie deficit is 25% when you eat 6000.

But, that 6000 calorie extra burn over non-exercise TDEE was so low key (compared to a shorter more intense exercise) - you easily burned only 50% carb stores, 50% fat. Or 3000 in carbs.

Probably in reality, not even that high of carbs burned.

What's going to help you do another 15 miles tomorrow, carbs or fat?

Everyone has enough fat - but your carbs stores are needed.

And that will easily be met eating 6000 calories, unless just chewing on blubber the whole time.

Probably could even meet it with eating 5000 calories, causing 3000 deficit.

So it's the consistent huge deficit that can suck eventually when body starts adapting.

But shoot, studies on fasting have shown metabolism actually increases in first 48 hrs. Of course after that it takes a nose dive.

So if the reason for your increased TDEE was lots of low key exercise, a couple days of increased deficit won't be that bad - because it was likely mainly fat you burned.

If you were to attempt say the Tour de France with that intensity level of increased TDEE daily, and cut out that many % calories - now you are talking some performance and muscle loss issues.

I've seen riders abandon because they had some stomach flu or issue, and couldn't eat enough, commenting they had already lost X amount of weight (and they ain't carrying much fat around), and needed to abandon because they could not continue that route without negatively impacting future races.

I always ask - if not hungry and willing to go that low today, if you are hungry are you willing to go that far above later?

Because sometimes the hunger can't be trusted at all.

I had a 3 hr ride couple weeks back, since I knew no workout on Sunday, my post-ride snack wasn't as required for performance. So got my ride stats dealt with, took shower, got distracted, and by a late dinner time I still wasn't that hungry, but sure was getting tired. Gee, I wonder why?

That day had a lunch of maybe 600 calories, 3000 cal burned on the bike, lost 6 lbs of weight despite drinking 3 x 24 oz water bottles, and I wasn't hungry.

I can assure you my brain was smarter than my stomach that day, and I made dinner and ate it even though not getting hungry yet, but almost falling asleep. I can't imagine what my body would have tried to recover with if I had just gone to sleep. Probably would have effected my workout on Monday at that point, unless I got hungry and made it up on Sunday.

[Heybales]

Another more accurate way to get to that figure, based on what you actually do and not mere calc's - since you are using a Fitbit and all.

Get your last Fitbit weekly report - if average week.

Daily burn figure on average - divided my Mifflin BMR (MFP has that in their tool section).

There's your personal daily activity factor, you might call it your daily average METS.

Now get your BMR for goal weight from same tool - multiply by same METS figure.

So there is your average daily burn at goal weight - if you kept your intensity in your workouts the same.

Some would likely be faster and burn more though, some probably not since already lighter weight.

So usually what most find is that a reasonable deficit off current weight daily burn, has you eating even less than future weight daily burn.

So it's actually reasonable to lose faster pace than eating at future weight would give you.

It is a great method, and I have probably 20 people that reached goal weight I helped before the ease of using Fitbit to get that method. You do sorta glide in to goal weight very slowly - but the workouts starting turning great eating so close to maintenance, that they shape the body even better - and most realized they didn't want to reach final goal weight, happy where they were at with more muscle.