If you have AFIB, consider the following

[charltonjohn50]

I have been a fitbit user for over 2 years . I am a very active 66 year old man who goes to the gym everyday . Before I had a fitbit I would check on my health through a BP monitor and at the gym on top of any tests done by my GP or health advisor. I always had a low resting heart rate between 45 and 50 and good BP 125 over 70. Once I had my fitbit I thought I could rely on it and lost count of the people I have recommended it to. About 3 months ago I started to feel more tired working out but as I do a lot of long haul travel I would check my HR on fit bit and put it down to jet lag etc . Even when the equipment at the gym was telling me my HR was 160 as my fitbit HR was showing 120 I preferred to believe it. To cut a long story short I was admitted to hospital because my heart rate was 150 and was diagnosed as having AFIB. At the time the hospital were panicking that someone had a resting heart rate of 150 my good old fit bit was telling me 65 ....a little bit high for me but ok. I got a friend to wear my fit bit to check it was not faulty and it had the same reading as their own fitbit they were wearing. The consultant said that fitbit and other devices cannot pick up the variations when the heart is jumping around in AFIB so having read so many conflicting reports on this it is very scary because I can prove it is useless. Last week I purchased a chest monitor which almost mirrored the readings of the gym equipment and to my phone but the readings on the fitbit are always totally different. over a 4 day comparison resting the fitbit is reading between 15 to 20 beats lower than the chest monitor and when exercising reading 40-50 beats lower!!

For this reason I certainly now know it cannot be used if a person has AFIB and think that Fitbit need to come up with something better and some words of warning too. AFIB is a very annoying condition to arrive on someone who is a dedicated gym goer and mine has not been resolved as yet . After one cardioversion I am still on meds which themselves affect how good exercise makes you feel. My concern is that my problem could have been detected maybe 3 or 6 months ago before it got too bad and therefore noticeable. I believed unwisely the fitbit data was correct which continued showing how healthy my heart was even when I was in re suss at the hospital

Moderator edit: format/subject clarity

[J-flex]

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@charltonjohn50 wrote:

I have been a fitbit user for over 2 years . I am a very active 66 year old man who goes to the gym everyday . Before I had a fitbit I would check on my health through a BP monitor and at the gym on top of any tests done by my GP or health advisor. I always had a low resting heart rate between 45 and 50 and good BP 125 over 70. Once I had my fitbit I thought I could rely on it and lost count of the people I have recommended it to. About 3 months ago I started to feel more tired working out but as I do a lot of long haul travel I would check my HR on fit bit and put it down to jet lag etc . Even when the equipment at the gym was telling me my HR was 160 as my fitbit HR was showing 120 I preferred to believe it. To cut a long story short I was admitted to hospital because my heart rate was 150 and was diagnosed as having AFIB. At the time the hospital were panicking that someone had a resting heart rate of 150 my good old fit bit was telling me 65 ....a little bit high for me but ok. I got a friend to wear my fit bit to check it was not faulty and it had the same reading as their own fitbit they were wearing. The consultant said that fitbit and other devices cannot pick up the variations when the heart is jumping around in AFIB so having read so many conflicting reports on this it is very scary because I can prove it is useless. Last week I purchased a chest monitor which almost mirrored the readings of the gym equipment and to my phone but the readings on the fitbit are always totally different. over a 4 day comparison resting the fitbit is reading between 15 to 20 beats lower than the chest monitor and when exercising reading 40-50 beats lower!!

For this reason I certainly now know it cannot be used if a person has AFIB and think that Fitbit need to come up with something better and some words of warning too. AFIB is a very annoying condition to arrive on someone who is a dedicated gym goer and mine has not been resolved as yet . After one cardioversion I am still on meds which themselves affect how good exercise makes you feel. My concern is that my problem could have been detected maybe 3 or 6 months ago before it got too bad and therefore noticeable. I believed unwisely the fitbit data was correct which continued showing how healthy my heart was even when I was in re suss at the hospital!!!

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I absolutely agree with you.   I’ve been vocal about FitBit not being an accurate heart rate  monitor much to the disapproval of some Fitbit supporters and Fitbit employees. Fitbit is good for tracking steps, distance and of course providing the date & time.  The challenge portion of Fitbit is fun.  I’m glad you sought professional help & advice.  Listen to your doctor 😊

[WavyDavey]

Glad to hear you're doing better @charltonjohn50.

Fitbit does have this disclaimer prominently posted, not sure how they could clarify it better? I understand some people might want to use their fitbits in a way not recommended, but is it fair to come back at the company if we're mis-using the product?

This product is not a medical device, and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. With regard to accuracy, Fitbit has developed leading hardware and algorithms to track fitness information and is constantly improving its products to calculate measurements as accurately as possible. The accuracy of Fitbit devices is not intended to match medical devices or scientific measurement devices, but is intended to give you the best information available in a wearable activity tracker.

[J-flex]

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@WavyDavey wrote:

Glad to hear you're doing better @charltonjohn50.

Fitbit does have this disclaimer prominently posted, not sure how they could clarify it better? I understand some people might want to use their fitbits in a way not recommended, but is it fair to come back at the company if we're mis-using the product?

This product is not a medical device, and is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. With regard to accuracy, Fitbit has developed leading hardware and algorithms to track fitness information and is constantly improving its products to calculate measurements as accurately as possible. The accuracy of Fitbit devices is not intended to match medical devices or scientific measurement devices, but is intended to give you the best information available in a wearable activity tracker.

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So where on the website is this disclaimer located?

[emili]

@J-flex Hey there-- here is the link to the disclaimer. https://www.fitbit.com/legal/safety-instructions

@charltonjohn50 I am sorry to hear about what happened - that had to have been a really scary thing for you. I do think sometimes we want things to be what they aren't ever intended for and I think your story is one of those times. Your tracker is the guardrails to your fitness- no more no less. It can not do what equipment specifically designed do. And it doesn't advertise itself to be that. I hope you are feeling better and stronger with each passing day. Happy, healthy new year to you- Cheers!

[bcalvanese]

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@charltonjohn50 wrote:

I have been a fitbit user for over 2 years . I am a very active 66 year old man who goes to the gym everyday . Before I had a fitbit I would check on my health through a BP monitor and at the gym on top of any tests done by my GP or health advisor. I always had a low resting heart rate between 45 and 50 and good BP 125 over 70. Once I had my fitbit I thought I could rely on it and lost count of the people I have recommended it to. About 3 months ago I started to feel more tired working out but as I do a lot of long haul travel I would check my HR on fit bit and put it down to jet lag etc . Even when the equipment at the gym was telling me my HR was 160 as my fitbit HR was showing 120 I preferred to believe it. To cut a long story short I was admitted to hospital because my heart rate was 150 and was diagnosed as having AFIB. At the time the hospital were panicking that someone had a resting heart rate of 150 my good old fit bit was telling me 65 ....a little bit high for me but ok. I got a friend to wear my fit bit to check it was not faulty and it had the same reading as their own fitbit they were wearing. The consultant said that fitbit and other devices cannot pick up the variations when the heart is jumping around in AFIB so having read so many conflicting reports on this it is very scary because I can prove it is useless. Last week I purchased a chest monitor which almost mirrored the readings of the gym equipment and to my phone but the readings on the fitbit are always totally different. over a 4 day comparison resting the fitbit is reading between 15 to 20 beats lower than the chest monitor and when exercising reading 40-50 beats lower!!

For this reason I certainly now know it cannot be used if a person has AFIB and think that Fitbit need to come up with something better and some words of warning too. AFIB is a very annoying condition to arrive on someone who is a dedicated gym goer and mine has not been resolved as yet . After one cardioversion I am still on meds which themselves affect how good exercise makes you feel. My concern is that my problem could have been detected maybe 3 or 6 months ago before it got too bad and therefore noticeable. I believed unwisely the fitbit data was correct which continued showing how healthy my heart was even when I was in re suss at the hospital!!!

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Fitbit's are not medical devices, but it seems you came to depend on them as if they they where.

This is your mistake and not at all fitbit's fault.

Sorry for your condition, but you are wrong.

[SunsetRunner]

@charltonjohn50 it's well known Fitbit is far from being accurate HR monitor. I use pulse oximeter as an additional, and more medical, device if I'm in doubt. Also as a minor backup, I check my pulse with the phone app ( there are plenty of them ). Still, this isn't same as reading your ECG but gives the better picture. In my case, Charge 2 very often doesn't detect any heart rate ( I just see two dashes ). Before I used to complain quite a lot about it, now I just don't care anymore. It won't work for me and I came to accept it. I simply don't believe Fitbit HR readings and one MUST NOT rely on them. Your case shows that too much trust in this feature may bring serious consequences. One thing about HR monitors in the gym equipment is that they use different technology to obtain the readings ( electrodes rather than LED ). It doesn't mean they are more or less accurate but it is another source of data that we may not want to ignore ( on the elliptical in my case, when the Fitbit shows 120, the machine shows 160, that was last Saturday ). Usually, you need to put two thumbs on the electrodes. This builds little more accuracy, as pulse detected in your right side of the body will be slightly different than on your left side of the body. That's why it also matters on which wrist you wear your Fitbit. When I use pulse oximeter I test my pulse on both hands on different fingers. Yes, even a different finger will show you different reading! try it with any HR phone app! The key is to learn to interpret the data coming from various sources and use it responsibly 🙂

[charltonjohn50]

  Why do some people have a problem understanding common sense.
The reason for my message to fitbit users was not to lay blame on fitbit for me it was just to warn people who may have or develop my condition and hopefully avoid anyone having a heart attack that when exercising the readings on their fitbit can be as much as 90bpm out which is very dangerous for them. What is wrong in that people?

[USAF-Larry]

What is wrong with people, @charltonjohn50, is anyone that is having that type of heart problems should be consulting their doctor, not their Fitbit.  The Fitbit is not a medical device, and should not be used by persons with heart conditions to monitor the heart rates

[charltonjohn50]

thanks JSR for the constructive comments. . Re the gym equipment I been doing some checks on the different equipment at my gym since I bought a Polar Chest strap monitor . first of all I found that the polar readings and that of all the machines was the same until I realised it was because the app was linking my readings to the machine lol. However after having deactivated that feature on the app and starting again I have to say that the readings from the chest monitor were always within 5BPH of all the machines .

[GershonSurge]

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@charltonjohn50 wrote:
  Why do some people have a problem understanding common sense.
The reason for my message to fitbit users was not to lay blame on fitbit for me it was just to warn people who may have or develop my condition and hopefully avoid anyone having a heart attack that when exercising the readings on their fitbit can be as much as 90bpm out which is very dangerous for them. What is wrong in that people?

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Fitbit was sued because their heart rate monitors are not as accurate as represented in the advertising, esp. at a high rates. 

There are other errors that can happen. For instance, at a cadence of about 120 bpm, the pulse shown tends to be the cadence instead of the pulse. This can give the appearance of a runaway pulse for those who exercise at a low pulse rate. 

Even the expensive monitors used in hospitals can be off by a bunch. They do that every so often so the doctors can order expensive tests. 

[charltonjohn50]

sorry was cut off mid flow so my problem is and unique to me I guess is my 1.5 hour workout showed my BPM as average of 200 which is obviously too high even though I felt OK. Fitbit maximum showed 120 the whole session. Because of all these differences until I go back to see the Cardiologist I have been taking my pulse manually and its never anything like the Polar reading or gym equipment and nearer to the fitbit. Also been using a clinically approved BP and Pulse monitor which usually shows my heart rate to be lower than Fitbit so imaging how confusing this all is. I just hope other people reading it will come to my conclusion that with Arrhythmia or Atrial Fibrillation something I never knew I had until recently its probably impossible to rely on anything completely but with the chest monitor agreeing with gym that's probably at least picking up the maximum heartbeat when it skips .I have come to the conclusion that if my BP is ok which it has been I will only worry about the BPM if I feel too bad to continue exercising. Until I am told by the Doc otherwise .

And before anyone else comes  and tells me I am wrong please try to read and understand the contents properly which are just my opinions and experiences to help others and only in my case because my heart has gone out of sync . thank you

[charltonjohn50]

and because it sounds like some of these replies came from" Fitbit Huggers" or maybe employees I have to say that in my opinion with or without a heart condition and whether a known or unknown heart condition then it is better and safer to wear the Polar Chest Monitor over a Fitbit when you are properly exercising

[WavyDavey]

I think the issue is nobody reads the fine print disclaimers. They make it very clear it's not a medical device, but who remembers reading that? 

I get that Fitbit use caused you confusion. But the need to warn people is a bit much. If everyone did their research and actually read the agreement, there would be fewer unmet expectations.

I guess the actual warning should be: if you have a serious medical condition, don't rely on a fitness tracker to treat or monitor it.

[charltonjohn50]

as far as the comments about a disclaimer is concerned the whole point has been missed . 

The point is I did not know I had any medical condition when I bought a Fitbit HR (which does sell that it means heart rate) . I had therefore presumed it would be fairly accurate, in case gym equipment was not..... people like me who were unaware of having any medical condition that waiver wording would not help anything............What Fitbit and other heart rate monitors should state if they want people to be safe ad have a proper disclaimer to cover anyone who might be developing AFIB which is the most common heart problem in the world apparently especially among athletes, is "that they should always seek medical advice and have regular check ups with their GP before embarking on any form of strenuous exercise because the Fitbit cannot  give accurate readings if there are any underlying heart conditions present.......

If that was not in very small print am sure quite a few people would be put off buying them for measuring heart rate .

On that note I am leaving the Fitbit forum as I know understand how to exercise safely with this condition. I can only hope these posts will make a few more people aware of the dangers of relying on a wristband monitor to see how healthy your heart is performing. 

This is the health tip I would give after my experience. especially to anyone over 55 doing strenuous exercise and wearing a wristband. Providing you go to a good gym with new equipment if the HR readings differ greatly with your wristband then go get checked out by your GP and let an ECG determine if there is any Arrhythmia or AFIB developing.  Good Luck

[bbarrera]

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@WavyDavey wrote:

I think the issue is nobody reads the fine print disclaimers. They make it very clear it's not a medical device, but who remembers reading that? 

I get that Fitbit use caused you confusion. But the need to warn people is a bit much.

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They don't make it very clear if its hidden on a random disclaimer page.

They have no problem portraying HRM as accurate and allowing you to get same benefits as chest strap:

Source: https://www.fitbit.com/chargehr

I don't see any disclaimers on the product page, or the HR FAQ page.

[rkowalik]

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@bbarrerawrote:

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@WavyDavey wrote:

I think the issue is nobody reads the fine print disclaimers. They make it very clear it's not a medical device, but who remembers reading that? 

I get that Fitbit use caused you confusion. But the need to warn people is a bit much.

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They don't make it very clear if its hidden on a random disclaimer page.

They have no problem portraying HRM as accurate and allowing you to get same benefits as chest strap:

Source: https://www.fitbit.com/chargehr

I don't see any disclaimers on the product page, or the HR FAQ page.

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Published October 31, 2017... about two months before the originating post by charltonjohn50.

.

Could Your Fitbit Prevent a Stroke?

"Last week, at the Connected Health Conference in Boston, researchers from Fitbit presented some data that didn’t get as much attention as they should have. Part of that was due, perhaps, to how the study was presented—not in a high-profile, main-stage session, but rather on a sheet of cardboard during the meeting’s “poster session.” That’s where you typically find hordes of post-doctoral researchers desperately searching for an audience for their work, as conference-goers mill around between panel discussions. Still, this is where you’ll often find some of the best stuff at medical meetings.

"In this case, Fitbit, the San Francisco wearable pioneer, presented data on an algorithm it had developed to detect a certain dangerous heart arrhythmia, called atrial fibrillation, using a technology already built into its wristband trackers: photoplethysmography, or PPG."

So it seems that in addition to disclaimers that aren't always as prominently displayed/offered as they should be, it seems that Fitbit has been working, behind the scenes, to do exactly what they claim they can't do! Granted, this is still in its infancy, but Apple is taking their Apple Watch in the same direction.

Once the dust settles over the initial skirmish over "Who Brought It To Market First," the next battleground will be over accuracy. Expect lots and lots of research studies to follow.

Oh... and how did I get here?

I was diagnosed with AFib a couple of months ago. A recent attempt at cardioversion proved fruitless — four shocks, no conversion back to normal sinus rhythm. I'm on three different drugs, and overall I'm feeling better. After seeing the most–recent Apple Watch commercial during the Olympics, it dawned on me that maybe something like my Blaze or an Apple Watch might be a good thing for me to wear, help me get a better handle on my situation.

Will I upgrade to a newer Fitbit device, or splurge on the Apple Watch? I guess it depends on who first finds the cojones to step up and say, "We can help you with that."

[bbarrera]

@rkowalik medical grade EKG and afib (FDA approved) is already available on Apple Watch. Its from a third party:

https://store.alivecor.com/products/kardiaband

[WavyDavey]

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@bbarrerawrote:

@rkowalik medical grade EKG and afib (FDA approved) is already available on Apple Watch. Its from a third party:

https://store.alivecor.com/products/kardiaband

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Am I mis-reading that? $200 PLUS $99 annually?   Ouch.

[rkowalik]

Where the frack did my edited post go??