Loosing weight without loosing muscle help

[Deeks]

Hi i have just started my journey on changing mylifestyle to be healthier. I started at 191 lbs 2 months ago and have been able to get down to 169 so far. The problem i seem to be running into is that i am not just loosing fat i am also loosing muscle and the goal ultimately is to shed the fat( get lean ) then put some more muscle on. I was 29.1% body fat at 191 and am 24% at 169 so ive lost a few lbs of muscle and want to make sure that i don't continue loosing more getting to my goal weight of 150lbs. I am 5'8 Male 28 years of age. I currently do 30min of weightlifting a day and 30min of cardio, i have a active job ( plumber ) and ive been eating around 1800cal a day on average. I have been trying to track everything through my fitbit and been entering all my meals into it as well. on average im doing 150g of protein a day, 70g of fat, and 120g of carbs(trying to keep macro of 35p/35f/30c). been eating other chicken,turkey,bison,extra lean beef, or venison with every meal and 2- 3 salads a day. I go on hikes every weekend ( 5 - 8 hours ). I have been taking Vega one for protein powder/ vitamins and taking bcaa's before and after my work out . My fitbit tracker ( charge hr ) chart is telling me with my metabolic rate and exercise through out the day that im burning around 4000cal a day but i feel like that seems extremely high. I figure that the actual calories burned+metabolic rate is probably 60-75% of that. Any input would be greatly appreciated thanks a ton!

[divedragon]

Intermittent fasting.  Its used by bodybuilders to cut the fat and even gain muscle.  You still eat the same 1800 calories a day, but you do it in an 8 hour window and you fast between this window.  Google "Intermitent Fasting" and you'll get all sorts of references with it.

[tally_]

I'm no bodybuilder, but I can tell you the best way to maintain/gain muscle while loosing fat is to go low carb (less than 30 net carbs a day, fiber doesn't count) and increase you protien/fat intake. What you're aiming for is ketosis, it's a metabolic process through which you body switches over to running on fat stores rather than carbs in the bloodstream or eating away at muscle mass during periods of fasting. 

Personally, I've lost over 20lbs this way and throughout the process gained muscle. On days or weeks that I don't loose any weight my body fat percentage always drops. I also feel really healthy and full of energy! It's what works for me, though I know it's not for everyone. 

Good luck!

[SunsetRunner · Accepted solution]

You are going to loose muscle when loosing fat. Accept it. Skeletal muscle and ligaments that can't be directly trained exist throughout your entire body and work to hold your organs in place. As long as you are still hitting the gym and are able to lift as much as you could before I wouldn't worry about it. I would only start worrying when you suddenly can't lift the same weight you could before(assuming your diet isn't the root cause(I can lift more when I am carbed up than when I am ketogenic)). Also keep in mind that bioelectrical impedence measuring devices are highly inaccurate and are only useful when you are consistent in how/when you measure yourself. There is also a "hump" where you transition from "regular" to "athletic" body type. When I first dropped from 270 to 181 durring college and had a six pack I was still getting rated at 17% BF. Once I changed to athletic mode I was at 12% which matched what my coach predicted.

[Deeks]

Thanks for all the answers greatly appreciate it. I definitly am lifting more then I was before so I guess that's a good sign and my last weigh in lost no muscle I also upped. My cal intake. I'm going to try to up it a bit more as come last Monday when I weighed in lost 2.3 lbs of fat and had 1900-2000cal diet so going to try 2200 see If that helps me keep at 1.5 lb - 2lbs lose with helping keeping my muscle more intact. Again thanks again for the responses greatly appreciated. One question did it take you longer to loose the first bit of weight till u hit 17% or to go from 17-12? Did you change your workout routine when you went to 12%?

[SunsetRunner]

Looking back when I was 278 and now as I am 190 I am loosing less weight now than I was then, but I am making about the same progress percentage wize. For an example if I was loosing 1% of BF a week when I started that means I was dropping nearly 3 lbs when I started, and now I am dropping only 2 lbs. Of course when I started I significantly changed my diet which meant that I initially lost a lot of weight due to differences in water retention and the ammount of food being processed in my gut.

[divedragon]

This has long been the conventional wisdom; however, there is new eveidence that it may not be necessary.  Even without calorie restriction, body composition can be significantly altered using such techniques as Intermittent Fasting.  It is believed that the human gnome was created during the time when humans were hunter-gathers which meant they would often go without food for a day to several days and then, when they did make a kill, they had limited time in which to consume due to spoilage.  They would obviously need to be strong enough and have enough energy to pursue game or search for food and thus the body adapted by its ability to burn fat, but leave muscle in tact long enough to obtain the next meal.  The catabolic process (muscle tissue consumption) doesn't seem to even begin until more than 60 hours of fasting has passed and then it stops soon after that (again, to preserve muscle for the hunt). 

The study I referenced in the beginning was published in the American Journal of Clincal Nutrition.  Here is the abstract:

Background:Although consumption of 3 meals/d is the most common pattern of eating in industrialized countries, a scientific rationale for this meal frequency with respect to optimal health is lacking. A diet with less meal frequency can improve the health and extend the lifespan of laboratory animals, but its effect on humans has never been tested.

Objective:A pilot study was conducted to establish the effects of a reduced-meal-frequency diet on health indicators in healthy, normal-weight adults.

Design:The study was a randomized crossover design with two 8-wk treatment periods. During the treatment periods, subjects consumed all of the calories needed for weight maintenance in either 3 meals/d or 1 meal/d.

Results:Subjects who completed the study maintained their body weight within 2 kg of their initial weight throughout the 6-mo period. There were no significant effects of meal frequency on heart rate, body temperature, or most of the blood variables measured. However, when consuming 1 meal/d, subjects had a significant increase in hunger; a significant modification of body composition, including reductions in fat mass; significant increases in blood pressure and in total, LDL-, and HDL-cholesterol concentrations; and a significant decrease in concentrations of cortisol.

Conclusions:Normal-weight subjects are able to comply with a 1 meal/d diet. When meal frequency is decreased without a reduction in overall calorie intake, modest changes occur in body composition, some cardiovascular disease risk factors, and hematologic variables. Diurnal variations may affect outcomes.

[SunsetRunner]

I've been experimenting with intermittent fasting recently after having gone through a 28 day water fast. Durring the water fast I lost about 15 lb's of muscle and 15 lb's of fat and another 10 lb's of waste/water. In the month since the fast I have consumed a 1350 calories a day while allegedly burning 7-14000(The first number based on my BMR, the 2nd based on my fit bit tracker/activity) calories per week yet have remained the same weight (196 lb's). I believe that the lean body mass that I lost during the fast was prioritized by my incomming calories and nutrients allowing my body to rebuild muscle while at a caloric deficit. 1 lb of fat is 3500 calories, while 1 lb of muscle is equivalent to 1600 calories. So essentially my body would take 3500 calories from a lb of fat in my body add that to the 1350 calories I ate for the day, use 1600 to build a lb of muscle, and the rest to maintain my metabolism resulting in no net weight loss. Obviously this is much conjecture on my part and not scientific by any means(especially since the fitbit aria seems to jump quite a bit when guessing bf% requiring me to average out several days readings) but I have dropped from 23.4% BF to my current BF of 17% over 4 weeks despite only loosing 4 lb's of weight(last measured weight was 192).

Anyways I now fast every thursday for aprox. 36 hours. It helps give me some leeway if I decide to eat out on the weekend(I don't have an explicit cheat day, but if), and if I don't it's just allows me to be more appreciative of what little I do eat(it's better to eat 1350 calories than 0).

[Peggie]

Cannot tell you how pleased I am to read this post @SunsetRunner. I have been changing my body for a couple of years now. Having lost 80 lbs and gained muscle and throughout it all, the wellness coach from work has been weighing me on a Tanita scale. Recently we have wondered if we should switch the Tanita to "athletic mode" since my body has changed so much and we wonder why it still has my body fat at about 28%. I haven't insisted on the change since my numbers have consistently changed for the better... But my body fat comes out at about 22% with both tape measure and caliper calculations... I think I will switch to athletic mode next time (October 14! Soon!) just to see.... Funny. I am definately NOT fat anymore but the scale still makes me nervous!

Thanks for the post! Keep Fitbitting!

[Deeks]

Thanks again for all the responses, I got into a weight lifting program and do 30min of cardio a day and have now dropped from 24% to16%bf and have only lost 7lbs which is good as I seem to be building my lean body mass back up. Also have upped my cal intake to 2300 and still loose everywhere. Think I'll be sticking to this routine till I hit my ideal bf% then try to go into a small calorie surplus to help gain back more muscle. I've also been taking multivitamin everyday, bcaas before and after workout, protein shakes before and after workout as well as glutamine. Thanks again