Not Losing Weight

[SunsetRunner]

Good afternoon!

I've been going at this by myself, but I finally decided to stop in and see what others may say.

In the past (while I was in college), I was very active, but a couple of years ago I got a full-time job, marriage and all the fun responsibilities, so I stopped working out like I used to (7 days a week, with breaks only if I had a cold).

I've been bringing myself back into it, but the weight doesn't seem to be coming off. It's frustrating! I only weight myself once a week on a Monday, to log it before I start the week off. For the past 3 of those, I barely saw any change, apart from 2 pounds initially.

Hence, a question of how accurate is FitBit tracking. I tend to presume it's not AWFULLY accurate, in terms of calorie burn during exercise, but what about other aspects?

I work out 6 days a week for 1.5 hours (intensive circuit for 30 minutes & elliptical for 30 minutes before and after that), my average calorie intake for a day is around 1500, which is a comfortable range for me, and allows me the benefit of eating a bit more on the weekends, when I want to have a meal out with family, for example.

Still, the fact that the weight isn't coming off is frustrating. What could be an issue? Just looking for feedback from people who've been through the process.

My averages / day:

Steps - 12000

Floors - 7

Miles - 5.2

Calorie Burn - 4000

Active Minutes - 125

Stats:

Height - 6ft

Weight, atm: 262lbs

To note after all that: I do have a lot of muscle. I did close combat martial arts for a while, so I have absolutely zero issue with exercise in terms of intensity (it's hard as hell, but my body can manage it still). Obviously, it's not perfect and I want to die after each workout, but I don't feel like I'm working at max capacity, yet.

I don't feel restricted with food, either, but I am wondering if FitBit tracks calories well. I eat almost the same thing every day though, and it's fine accourding to MyFitnessPal, as well.

Any ideas?

[pjf53]

You are right that calorie deficit resulting from diet and exercise is the driver of weight loss .  You are wrong to say it is easy.  It is achievable but takes sacrifice, dedication and perseverance.  It is well worth it but not easy.  If you do not learn how to eat properly the loss will be temporary.

Straight calorie deficit without muscle building or maintenance will result in weight loss but it will be both fat and muscle loss.  The muscle loss part is ok to a degree but most people want to lose only the fat.  

[Dominique]

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@MartinN1 wrote:

To lose weight you need to spend more calories than get satiated.

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I don’t understand the above. To lose weight, you need to expend more energy than you take in (eating). Satiety is the feeling of having had enough (in this case, food). It is not directly related to weight loss. Indirectly, yes: if you eat a lot of food that are very satiating, but not too caloric, you will be more likely to be in a caloric deficit and stay in that deficit.

Regarding the "easy" part: if losing weight was easy, every one would do it and no one would be asking questions about it.

As to taking medicines, it comes with problems of its own, and it’s probably not what most people would want to consider first. 

[Sarah_Amsterdam]

Hi  Same here at first. Then I started eating smaller portions more often a day (6 times) Although my weight wouldn't go down at first, I noticed a change in bodyfat vs muscles (which way heavier). Still the process is awfully slow!!!  I feel like hanging on the emergency brake all the time. One bad weekend and it seems like it is all back. I diminished on salt intake and that made me lose some weight too. Alcohol is also pretty bad. Well you probably know all that. 

Good luck!

[SunsetRunner]

BMI is generally a very poor measurement, especially if you have a more then average amount of muscle mass, which makes BMI calculations meaningless. Measuring your weight alone is actually better, but much better is to focus on your body fat percentage combined with your lean body mass, which will make it possible to more accurately calculate your BMR and the weight of excess fat you need to lose.

Best is to use a body composition analyzer to directly measure these things (and many more), so you know what you're dealing with and can make realistic goals and appropriate nutritional planning. From what you're writing, my guess is that you are way overestimating calories burned, and underestimating calories taken in.

If you haven't prepared your food yourself, you're just guessing. Remember, the most important kitchen tool is a scale!

Starbucks lists a Grande Frappuccino (16oz) as containing 410 kcal, with 140 kcal coming from fat. This is not good news. A Frappuccino is not a coffee, it's a snack with coffee taste. (and a very delicious one...)

From my own experience (and so much research I have done on the subject), resistance training works better than any cardio for fat burning, because it increases or maintains muscle strength/mass thereby maintaining or increasing your BMR. With a consistent caloric deficit, you will loose both fat and muscle, decreasing your BMR and making you weaker, unless you counteract it by resistance training. No amount of cardio will do this unless you have a very significant amount of excess body fat. Getting enough protein (1.0 - 1.4 g per lbs of lean body weight) is also crucial so that you can minimize your loss of muscle mass during caloric deficit.

[SunsetRunner]

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@pjf53 wrote:

I'm convinced weight training is key to eliminating fat

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I totally agree!

If you are in a consistent caloric deficit, you will lose both fat and muscle. If you don't do weight training to at least maintain your muscle mass, you will become weaker and weaker and your BMR will decrease accordingly making it even more difficult to stay in a caloric deficit. Also, make sure that the proportion of calories from protein in your daily allowance is high enough to maintain your muscle mass. E.g. in my case it's about 45% of daily calories allowance from protein, 20% from fat, and the remaining 35% from carbs.

[TheDeadJester]

I'm not convinced this is true, I use simple weight training, i.e. Lifting twice a week Curls and Fly only, and do 95% cardio. I cut out ALL Junk Food and Processed Sugars July of Last Year and depended on my Fitbit Charge HR info for most information. I went from 400lbs in July of 2016 to 167lbs today and can still bench 185lbs, but Fat Burn from Weights when you're overweight isn't the most important thing and hasn't been in the people I've met who've been successful. Removing foods that become fat is important.

[Dominique]

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@TheDeadJester wrote:

I'm not convinced this is true

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@TheDeadJester: this is a long topic with a lot of contributors to it. It is unclear whose post you’re answering. We may assume it was the previous one (in chronological order), but – for the sake of clarity – it can be a good idea to either quote the part of the statement your answer relates to, or to tag the author of that statement. If you don’t know how to tag someone in a post, see this other reply I wrote a few minutes ago.

[SunsetRunner]

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@TheDeadJester wrote:

I'm not convinced this is true, I use simple weight training, i.e. Lifting twice a week Curls and Fly only, and do 95% cardio. I cut out ALL Junk Food and Processed Sugars July of Last Year and depended on my Fitbit Charge HR info for most information. I went from 400lbs in July of 2016 to 167lbs today and can still bench 185lbs, but Fat Burn from Weights when you're overweight isn't the most important thing and hasn't been in the people I've met who've been successful. Removing foods that become fat is important.

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The importance of weight training during a caloric deficit is in minimising the loss of muscle mass to prevent your BMR from falling. The amount of calories you burn during weight training is too small to make any real difference. Also, it seems that the muscles you have been training is directly related to how much you can bench. However, I can only congratulate you on having preserved your bench press strength during the amazing fat loss you have achieved! Truly impressive! Cardio is certainly important to burning fat, especially when in a fasted state (low on glycogen so your body is forced to use more fat and muscle tissue as energy), but unless you're forcing your body to preserve muscle mass (with weight training) you will lose both fat and muscle mass, lowering your BMR.

It was only when I analysed and adjusted my food by counting calories (there's just no way around that!) that burning fat became easy. Your body composition will depend about 70% - 80% on what you eat, and only 20% - 30% on your training. I have no doubt that the main factor of you losing such a significant amount is the fact that you cut out all junk food and processed sugars.

So, in fact I agree on your main points. Whatever you did, it worked for you, and that's awesome! 

[SunsetRunner]

You mention you weigh on Mondays-do you take the weekends off?  

[Daves_Not_Here]

@TheDeadJester - congrats on going from 400 to 167 and sustaining it.  I'm not sure what is more inspirational to me - the massive life-changing weight loss, or the keeping it off.

@Dominique and @SunsetRunner - I'm interested in your opinions on the following question.  There seems to be a consensus that when losing weight, muscle wasting is an issue, and it is best minimized through weight training.

It seems to me that when someone is losing weight, they are burning glycogen and replenishing it from 3 sources: glucose in the blood, body fat, and muscle.  I believe excess glucose is consumed first.  Once blood glucose is lowered to some minimum threshold, fat and muscle reserves are drawn upon to provide glycogen through the process of glycogenesis (?)  So far so good?  (My education is in a different field, so I want to make sure I am not engaging in faulty reasoning).

So, if this is correct and excess energy is drawn from fat and muscle, then the question becomes what portion is taken from each and what mechanism determines the allocation?  (Could it be the level of insulin?)

When I engage in weight training, I stress my muscles and cause micro-tears.  Protein is consumed in the repair process, which normally results in more mass.  What's not clear to me is how this process functions in an energy deficit, or how it causes proportionally more fat to be drawn upon.  To me, it makes just as much sense that breaking down muscle fiber when you are effectively malnourished might make it more accessible for conversion to glycogen, resulting in more muscle wasting.

Full disclosure:  I'm skeptical about the whole muscle-wasting and BMR reduction issue.  I think it is overstated.  To me, it seems counterproductive when trying to lose weight to engage in an activity that (1) does not burn significant calories, (2) breaks down the muscle fiber you are trying to preserve, and (3) increases your appetite.  To me, a more direct path is to attain your target weight and then build muscle as necessary in the presence of a slight calorie surplus (mass, lose, mass, lose).

Anyway, that's my contrarian streak -- I'm interested to hear how weight training results in proportionally more energy being taken from fat than muscle (versus fat-burning cardio which we know draws from fat). 

[Baltoscott]

@Daves_Not_Here - I thought this was an interesting article that touches on the issues you've raised.  It is a popular press article, so it in part repeats some of the popular wisdom, but there are a few primary source links as well.  

[Dominique]

@Daves_Not_Here: I agree with you resistance training is not a very efficient way to burn calories (compared to cardio training). However, it’s not its main purpose. Keeping muscle is metabolically "expensive" (in an evolutionary sense, foods rich in protein are not the easiest to get), so when food is scarce (as in a hypocaloric diet), your body will tend to keep more fat and get rid of more muscle; from a survival point of view, this makes more sense (remember, as you’re dieting down to a lower weight, your body has no idea food is still plentiful around you). By engaging into resistance training, you’re providing your body with an incentive to keep more of its muscle mass, you’re signaling there’s a use for that muscle mass. Eating enough protein is another signal that some muscle can be preserved, even if food is scarce otherwise. No resistance training means (to your body) there’s not much use for whatever muscle you may have, so more of it could just as well go, especially if not much protein and carbs are available. I believe what determines the ratio of tissue (fat vs. lean) that go during a weight loss phase is what exercise you do / don’t do and what foods you eat / don’t eat. 

[SunsetRunner]

@Dominique very well said!

@Daves_Not_Here you got it down pretty well! Just one thing I want to add: when you overload your muscles to stimulate them to grow stronger (and bigger), tearing them apart (literally) in the form of micro tears, that your body then repairs, and then some, it doesn't actually break down your muscles, unless you overtrain. If you repeatedly overload your muscles (after an adequate recovery period between each overload) your muscles will grow stronger and bigger over time. This happens even during a caloric deficit, as long as you take in enough protein, and stimulate enough muscle growth to outpace any loss of muscle. In this way you're pretty much forcing your body to chose fat over muscle to get energy from, especially if you're low on glycogen.

When I calculate the best proportions between Protein/Fat/Carbs for me to burn fat, I get 45% of my calories from protein, 20% from fat, and the rest, 35%, from carbs.

[janeshmoe52]

I just started working out 5ish months ago, and I haven't seen much of a drop in weight. about 4 pounds. I did drop a pant size, and I seem to be on my way to dropping one more. I wasn't expecting things to move quickly, because I have never worked out before, and I ate a lot more fast food before this, so I wasn't terribly surprised. I'm with the other people who are saying it's probably too soon to call it.

[janeshmoe52]

I do the same most days, although I usually make Saturdays "real breakfast" day. It's made a lot of difference in my energy and weight.

[SunsetRunner]

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@janeshmoe52 wrote:

I just started working out 5ish months ago, and I haven't seen much of a drop in weight. about 4 pounds. I did drop a pant size, and I seem to be on my way to dropping one more. I wasn't expecting things to move quickly, because I have never worked out before, and I ate a lot more fast food before this, so I wasn't terribly surprised. I'm with the other people who are saying it's probably too soon to call it.

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Actually, if you have never worked out before, you can expect rapid results in the beginning (the first year or two), and it sure seems you have done just that. What you're describing is evidence that your body composition has improved quite a bit. Instead of tracking your weight, I suggest you use a body composition analyser to measure your body fat percentage, lean muscle mass, and BMR. That will give you a much better idea of what's actually happening and show you the progress you're making. It will also make it easier to fine tune your nutrition.

[janeshmoe52]

thanks for the advice! I'm mostly looking on making small changes in lifestyle I can maintain over time: my first change being, "less fast food". Eventually I will turn into a proper meal prepper, I'm sure. I'm currently logging food, just to see how I do nutritionally, on a regular basis. I don't put a whole lot of stock in weight, as I heard many times before I started that muscle was a more important goal.

[BrendaCHIP]

A couple of thoughts from someone who has ditched over 100 pounds.  

1)  Have you had your thyroid checked?

2) When I slide into the "diet mode" I tend to cut way back on the amount of food I eat.  My body switched into starvation mode and my weight loss stalls every time.

3) The kinds of food matter.  Highly processed food is the worse.  Whole foods that I make myself are the best.  I tend to lean towards plant based and I can eat a lot more food when I do that versus the frozen processed foods that are filled with high sodium and extra fat.  

4) Are you getting your heart rate up when you are working out?  

5) Eat most of your food earlier in the day so you have time to burn it off.  Eating large meals late at night doesn't allow much time to burn off the calories (and often times, keeps me awake!).

Good Luck!  Everyone is different and bodies react differently.  Hope you can figure out what works for yours.  

[Dominique]

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@BrendaCHIP wrote:

5) Eat most of your food earlier in the day so you have time to burn it off.  Eating large meals late at night doesn't allow much time to burn off the calories (and often times, keeps me awake!).  

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I agree with all your other points, except on this one. Nutrient timing only plays a very minor role: what matters for losing/maintaining/gaining weight is the energy balance at the end of the day. If you have to eat 2000 calories in order to reach your goal, it doesn’t matter if you "front-load" them at the beginning of the day, "back-load" them at the end, spread them evenly between 5 smaller meals or any other approach. Nothing wrong for you to eat a hefty breakfast, a normal lunch and a smaller dinner, but nothing wrong either for someone else to have a larger dinner later on in the day, and smaller feedings early on. It’s primarily a matter of personal preferences.

[MountainBoy]

When I was body building my BMI classified me as obese but I had almost zero body fat. Muscle weighs more than fat so it is possible when you start working out to have slow gain, no gain or to even gain weight.  However, muscle consumes calories so as you gain muscle your metabolism speeds up and you consume more calories i.e. fat.  You are on the right path but it just takes time.