Which is the lesser of two evils?

[BurdsNest]

Ok community, I know this question has been asked a million and one times.  And to all you biology and chemistry experts......which is the lesser of two evils.....Carbs or Calories?  I would love to hear your thoughts!

Sincerely,

Till  trying to lose 5pds but loving the challenge!

[susiebee44]

So many in the Community treat carbs as evil; me, I count calories and eat "good" carbs, avoiding cakes, cookies, and most starches.  I eat roughly the macros advised in My Fitness Pal.  I avoid almost all processed food.  Carbs per se just don't seem to be my nemesis. I seem to have found an eating plan that works for me, provides satiety, and doesn't promote eating binges. Sorry to be so sane and boring.

[Gordon-B]

If you are a diabetic, eating lots of carbs and high blood sugar spikes can do a lot of damage to your body over time.  Unlike fats and protein, you need to space out the carbs evenly throughout the day, and sometimes time your medication with how you will eat.  Excess weight isn't good for diabetics, either, but it's a longer-term issue and isn't as much a problem as a carb binge.

If you are non-diabetic, blood sugar isn't nearly as much of an issue.  Your body controls it much better.  Calories are a better measure, but you still want balance (100% carbs, 100% protein, and 100% fats are all bad plans.  What you probably want is a "low food" diet).

Some people (no, I'm not accusing anyone here) are willing to stick to the rules of a diet but will exploit any "loopholes" without thinking much about the consequences.  For these people, there should be no "free" foods unless they really should be "free" (e.g. water contains no calories, but drinking 6 liters all at once by a 165-lb person can be lethal).  If you tell them that mustard is a "free" food, some of them will drink a quart of it as one meal. 

[DominicJ]

For weight loss

Unless there is a specific case, theres no difference.

Calories are Calories

[Proudpatriot]

I pay attention to both carbs and calories.  Calories are important but not the only thing that matters.  The quality of the foods you eat are also important to weight loss.  I limit my carbs to around 30 per day (net of fiber).  I fnd that when I limit my carbs the calories take care of themselves.

My experience is that people who have emotional issues with food often overeat even when they are not hungry.  For those people limiting carbs may not help them lose weight because they will continue to overeat regardless of whether they limit their carbs.  However, there are other people who have big appetites (I am in this camp).  Limiting carbs helps those people control their appetites.  When appetiite is under control it is much easier to limit calories. 

I eat a low carb diet because it helps me feel less hungry and naturally eat less.  It works for me but you have to see what works for you.

[BurdsNest]

Thanks everyone for all your input.   I ask this because through my "Meltdown Challenge" my coach talks about Carbs.  I have been diligently tracking my food through Fit & WW (26 points) .  I have a 500 calorie deficit through Fit which would mean 1pd a week.  I haven't lost anything.  As a matter of fact the moment that I eat outside of my meal plan (1500) on Saturday,  I will always gain a pound or two.  I eventually lose it, but I'm just curious why I don't see the scale moving the other way.  So that's why I ask the questions....what should I be watching. Based on my height, current weight, gender, age, I should consume 1943 calories per day.  45 - 65% carbohydrate intake.  I'm usually around 45% - 49%.  Calories usually 1300 - 1500.  Huge deficit when I get my weekly report.  So......................what gives.  Maybe the amount I want to lose is too small.  Your thoughts!

Sincerely,

Love my FitBit community.

[Proudpatriot]

If you are doing X and it isn't working why not try something else?

[BurdsNest]

Have tried sooooooooooooooo many different things since March.  But I will continue trying!

Thanks!

[BurdsNest]

Proudpatriot, how do you only eat 30 carbs?  Just about everything we eat has carbs in it.  For me, 170.5, 158.2, 144.5,  etc.  Unless I'm not understanding what the 30 represents.

Thanks!

[Proudpatriot]

I subtract fiber from total carbs and keep the net around 30.  I do not eat any grains or starch.  I eat low carb vegetables and I vary my protein sources.  I don't worry about fat at all.  Some days are higher in fat than others.  I don't snack because I am rarely hungry between meals.  Everything does not have to have carbs in it.  

There are many ways to lose weight.  All of them involve eating less and moving more.  You need to find what works for you.  Clearly, what you are currently doing is not working.  You don't have to try low carb but you should definitely change something about WHAT you are eating.

The Atkins site is totally free and will tell you everything you need to know about low carb eating.  You do not have to eat the Atkins products to follow the eating plan.  I don't eat any Atkins products.  However, you need to read it and follow it the way it is written, which is very different from how the media portrays it.  Additionally, if you do not have a lot of weight to lose you may  have to count calories and carbs.  I started out at 5'3" tall, 235 lb so I lost weight easily at first.  I am now down to aroun 195.  If you are smaller it make take reducing carbs and calories to lose.

A typical menu for me would be:

Coffee with heavy cream (1 g carbs, no fiber)

3 hard boiled eggs (3 g carbs, no fiber)

Salad with some sort of protein, full fat dressing (27 g carbs, 9 g fiber)

Protein food (no carbs)

Broccoli (2 g carbs, 1 g fiber)

Brussels Sprouts (8 g carbs, 3 g fiber)

Total for that day would be 41 g total carbs, 13 g fiber  for a net of 28 g of net carbs.  I counted calories when I first started eating low carb.  After a while I realized that I did not need to count calories becaus my calories are always pretty low.  After the first 2 weeks I just wasn't as hungry as I used to be so I ate less.

[BurdsNest]

Proudpartiot, I hear what you're say.....I do the same with the carbs....I subtract the fiber.  I don't eat bread, pasta, drink soda, juice, butter, sauces, and lately, very, very little grain (1/2 cup of brown rice) to try to get a balanced meal.  Next week I will be cutting the grain.

I'm 5'3" and started out @ 166pds in 2013.......by last year this time (2014) , my weight stayed between 126 & 129 until February of 2015.    I currently weight 130.7 (fluctuates to 132)  and just want to drop a few pounds and go back to what I thought was my maintenance weight of 126 - 129.  So we're only talking 5 pds.  I do burn on average 2400 calories a day and eat like I said before, between 1300 & 1500 calories on average.  My workout is Sunday through Wednesday, and Saturday, 2hr workouts.

I will check out the Atkins.  Thank you for such good information,

Sincerely,

Open to suggestions

[josephz2va]

For me it's both in a controlled manner. Prepackaged diet. Yeah I know it's evil. But I have to maintain control. Portionalized, low on all values except protein. I keep my cards locked up, I lose up to a pound a day. Lost 4 pounds last week and already on my way down this week. 0.8 down in a day. Still a few more to go to concentrate on. I drink a couple tanks of water too for the high sodium to get flushed out good.

[Proudpatriot]

If you find it difficult to lose weight you might be trying to maintain too low a weight for you.  Maybe it has nothing to do with carbs.

[Heybales]

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@BurdsNest wrote:

Thanks everyone for all your input.   I ask this because through my "Meltdown Challenge" my coach talks about Carbs.  I have been diligently tracking my food through Fit & WW (26 points) .  I have a 500 calorie deficit through Fit which would mean 1pd a week.  I haven't lost anything.  As a matter of fact the moment that I eat outside of my meal plan (1500) on Saturday,  I will always gain a pound or two.  I eventually lose it, but I'm just curious why I don't see the scale moving the other way.  So that's why I ask the questions....what should I be watching. Based on my height, current weight, gender, age, I should consume 1943 calories per day.  45 - 65% carbohydrate intake.  I'm usually around 45% - 49%.  Calories usually 1300 - 1500.  Huge deficit when I get my weekly report.  So......................what gives.  Maybe the amount I want to lose is too small.  Your thoughts!

Sincerely,

Love my FitBit community.

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Since you obviously can't gain fat that fast unless you really ate 3500-7000 calories OVER maintenance on Saturday - you have of course gained water weight on Sunday.

It's called wedding cake syndrome.

When the brides and/or maids dieted all week long to fit in dresses, and then only eat a piece of cake and water at reception, and gain 2-4 lbs the next day.

Probably from increased sodium if you normally attempt to eat low, and from the fact when in a diet your body stores less glucose with attached water in the muscles.

But when you eat more, which usually includes more carbs, that water weight comes back.

No biggie - you are going to gain those when you go in to maintenance anyway.

Also, it's increased LBM (Lean Body Mass), and as such your body spends more energy dealing with that water, so increased metabolism too.

Just proves you are indeed in a deficit to what you burn really.

A 500 cal deficit is very realistic probably - but could also be wiped out by a combo of things.

How many of your workouts do you manually log and replace the calorie count with?

If you do, what is the calorie burn based on?

And lifting if done should be one that is manually logged.

Do you weigh all the food that goes in your mouth to calculate serving sizes?

Do you validate database entries of those foods in case some goofball can't copy over a nutrition label correctly?

Do you have any health issues putting extra stress on your body, which cause cause elevated cortisol and retained water?

There are usually very good known expected reasons why a body doesn't seem to be following the normal math.

Like did you come to that 500 cal deficit from no diet, or an even more extreme diet?

Many when they start using Fitbit are shocked their deficit may have been about 50% prior on diets they were doing, ie eating 1200 but easily burning 2400 daily. No body is going to like 50% deficit.

Sometimes sensitivies to carbs can make adherance harder, but it doesn't change the math, only the expectation of the numbers the math is based on.

[Heybales · Accepted solution]

If you are still at the last 4-5 lbs to be lost, that 500 may be too much for what your body wants to support.

You may need to tackle this a totally different way.

First confirming you have a fully burning body back.

Slowly increase your eating level with smaller deficit.

Daily for a week, 400 cal deficit. Then 300, ect. Until back at maintenance.

Eat at maintenance for a week. Confirm any strength training you do shows great progress, which it should.

Then switch to a method of your biggest cardio days with the biggest burn, take a 500 cal deficit.

Smaller burn days with resistance training, take a 250 cal deficit.

Rest days or just walking, no deficit.

Depending on how many days of each you got, and hopefully you do have a mix, that could give you a 1500-2000 cal deficit weekly, or about 1/2 lb.

And much less stressful on body. And you won't have those water weight fluctuations because you'll usually have glucose stores topped off eating at maintenance often enough.

Points in other post about accuracy of Fitbit giving you your daily figures is still important though, and accuracy of food eaten.

[BurdsNest]

Hey Heybales, as usual you come up with some great suggestions.  I am active from Sunday through Wednesday, most active Monday - Wednesday with two classes vs one on Sunday.  I do walk and run on the treadmill on those days as well, ( 1-2 miles) as use the machines for arms, abs and back for 10 minutes or so.  When I look back @ my workouts....4 are cardio, and 3 are strength training.  Last class on Wednesday being the most in strength training, and I rest on Thursday, and Friday as suggested to give you muscles a rest and to rebuild. My caloric intake based on 26 ww points is approximately 1400 calories on Fit.  WW doesn't count fruits and most vegetables in points, but Fit calculates everything as calories.  Since my Fit is connected to my ww, I earn fitness points..  Usually between 7 and 11 points daily.  My ww leader suggested that I eat anything over 6.  

I'm looking forward to trying this out.  You mentioned to me before that you thought 500 was too large for such a small amount of weight.  I will make sure I use a much smaller deficit on non-active days.

I'll keep you posted....

Sincerely,

Encouraged

[BurdsNest]

Heybales, forgot to ask.....what is a "fully burning body?"

[Heybales · Accepted solution]

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@BurdsNest wrote:

Heybales, forgot to ask.....what is a "fully burning body?"

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http://www.myfitnesspal.com/blog/heybales/view/reduced-metabolism-tdee-beyond-expected-from-weight-l...

Depending on how you got down to having only 4-5 lbs left, your body may not be burning as high as it could otherwise.

Study above is more recent then this which is good new, compared to this where they state it could be a life-long effect.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2i_cmltmQ6A

[Joy_]

I have lost close to 30 pounds since April. I am now well within the suggested range for my weight but I'd like to lose another 5 pounds, and maybe a few more even. I've found my weight loss has slowed down tremendously and I watch the date of weight loss achievement, on the Fitbit app, get further and further away.

I am thrilled at my accomplishment so far. I am wearing a size that I never thought possible. I continue to walk 3 to 4 miles every day and I feel more and more fit and healthy. So when I get on the scale, I am thankful for even a tenth of an ounce loss. I remind myself that my trend has been a losing one and I think of how far I've come. Even if it takes until April to lose the rest, that is fine with me.

I wish however, that the app could validate this. Yes, I look at the charts and see my loss, but I wish that there was more validation for how far I've come. I know it, but I wouldn't mind an app pat-on-the-back.

I can't seem to figure out how to delete this. My apologies. I've posted this in the wrong spot and I didn't mean to hijack this thread.