How low is "low carb"?

[Dominique]

A question to the low-carbers out there: how low on carbs is your low carb diet? I'm asking because it seems the amount varies quite a bit depending on which "guru" you ask: some say 30 to 50 grams, other less than 100 grams etc.

How many of you go low enough to get into ketosis? I read this blog post by Peter Attia (supposedly one of the low-carb "gurus") and he makes it sound quite freaky:

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Anyone who has bought a blood ketone meter knows how tough it can be to get “into” ketosis by carbohydrate restriction (since everyone asks, I use the Abbott Precision Xtra meter which uses two different strips: one for glucose and one for beta-hydroxybutyrate, or BHB). Most practitioners consider the minimum threshold of NK to be a fasting serum level of BHB above 0.5 mM. I’m a bit more stringent in my practice and like to see fasting BHB levels above 1 mM.   To give you a sense of one person’s numbers (mine), over the past 6 months my mean (i.e., arithmetic average) morning fasting level has been 1.7 mM with a median value of 1.4 mM. The highest morning level during that period was 5.2 mM. (The highest morning level I have ever measured in myself is 5.7 mM.)

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[SunsetRunner]

In a recent article by Dr. David Katz which appeared in Annual Review of Public Health (publlhealth.annualreviews.org – article title “Can we say what diet is best for health” or visit Katz’s web site for a link to the article) he also noted that there is “no single authoritative definition of a low-carbohydrate diet” and decided to use as an operational definition the Dietary Reference Intakes of the Institute of Medicine.  Katz used the figure of anything less than 45% of total calories consumed as carbohydrates as being “low”.  When I was experimenting with a low-carb diet myself several months ago I tried to limit my intake to between 30-50 grams per day.  However, for myself, I decided that was unsustainable for the long-term and moved to a more balanced diet.  The low-carb approach was a good way for me to jump-start a diet.  I did general blood tests before beginning the diet and then again after about four months and my general lab work was excellent (triglycerides to HDL ratio of 1.7 without taking any statins).  I’ll be doing the lab work again in a couple of months and I’ll be very interested to see if there has been any change since going back to a balanced diet but one in which I have been watching overall calories in/calories out and have significantly reduced sugars and upped fiber.

While it has been a while since I did the reading on low-carb diets, I believe that for those wanting to go into ketosis try to limit their carbs to less than 30 grams per day to start then hold to less than 50 grams forever after. 

There are some health reasons – especially in children with epilepsy that a ketogenic diet may be warranted – ask you MD if you are interested in knowing more although I expect if you have a child with epilepsy you have been exploring MANY options.  “The typical ketogenic diet, called the "long-chain triglyceride diet," provides 3 to 4 grams of fat for every 1 gram of carbohydrate and protein.” [Epilepsy Foundation]  You might think of this is a High Fat/Low Everything Else Diet.  That is especially true since a gram of fat has 9 calories and a gram of carbs/protein has 4 calories.

[carl669]

there's low carb, and then there's nutrional ketosis.  obviously, one can be low carb and not in ketosis.  personally, i like ketosis and try to stay under 30g/day.  i've been in ketosis for about a year now and love the steady energy i have throughout the day.  

i'm curious as to what part of Attia's post you found freaky.  i know low carb and/or ketosis isn't for everyone, but i've never thought of it as freaky.

[Dominique]

@SunsetRunner: thanks for the detailed info! Epilepsy isn't an issue for me or anyone close to me. Like you, I have been experimenting with low-carbing, or rather lower-carbing. It's a loose experiment: I've skipped items like pasta, rice and bread, but I still eat fruits and veggies. I hardly ate any sugary stuff before the experiment, so no change on that side. I don't count my intake, but I’m pretty sure I'm above 50 g, and probably even 100 g. I've had "free" meals (as described in Lyle McDonald's Guide to Flexible Dieting) every five days or so. After nearly three weeks, I haven't noticed much change one way or the other (weight, body fat, energy level etc.), not that I started this experiment with a given goal in mind. I'll carry one for a couple more weeks, but I think I've reached the same conclusion as you: I feel more comfortable with a more balanced diet that doesn't restrict one particular macronutrient and I can't picture myself eating less than 30 g of carbs on a semi-permanent basis.

[Dominique]

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@carl669 wrote:

i'm curious as to what part of Attia's post you found freaky.  i know low carb and/or ketosis isn't for everyone, but i've never thought of it as freaky.

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Actually, it was the part that involved measuring glucose and BHB on a daily basis. Of course, I understand most low-carbers don't do that and that he has a professional interest in documenting these values, acting as his own guinea pig. However, reading other blog posts of his really gave me the impression being in ketosis would be too much of a burden for me. As you said, it's clearly not for everyone.

[SunsetRunner]

Good morning Dominique - I expect you are already familiar with My Fitness Pal but if not, it is a good and easy way to track nutrients/calories.  It can be set to show up to five categories which you can modify depending on what you are interested in.  I have mine for carbs, protein, fat, sugar and fiber.  I've customized it to the levels I want and also have the MFP app on my phone which is handy for scanning in the labels of some of the items that I have.  The MFP food database is quite extensive.  I also have mine synced with both Fitbit and Digifit.  Similar to how I use Fitbit I think of MFP as a general guide.  For instance, I have sugar set to 30 grams per day.  But since I eat a reasonable amount of fruit which is often high in natural sugar keeping below the 30 grams does not always happen.  When it goes over I just glance at the daily totals see where most of the "damage" came from and if it is fruit ignore it.  If it is something else I'll pay more attention next time.  I also found that getting enough fiber is a real challenge so I've recently added fiber "gummies" a couple of times a day to help boost that area.

[Gravity_Bug]

I try to limit myself to 6g of carbs per meal, this keeps me in Ketosis no problems at all.

A few days I had 1-2g all day, I thought it would be better but I didn't feel to crash hot.

[Dominique]

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@Gravity_Bug wrote:

I try to limit myself to 6g of carbs per meal, this keeps me in Ketosis no problems at all.

A few days I had 1-2g all day, I thought it would be better but I didn't feel to crash hot.

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Just curious: what kind of fruits and veggies are you able to eat that wouldn't exceed 6g?

[Gravity_Bug]

Hi Dominique,

Fruits are out with the exception of Strawberries and Passionfruit, that's all I have anyhow.

You can't go crazy on vegetables, steer clear of any vegetable that grown under ground eg. carrots and potatoes. They are too starchy and carb heavy. I tend to stick to Lettuce, Broccoli, Grean Beans, Celery and spinach.

Some nuts are also good, Almonds and Pecans I tend to have.

An additional note on Carb counting;

Only count 'Usable' or 'Net' carbs, this is calculated by

Total Carbs (minus) Total Fibre

Fibre cannot be digested and should not be included in your Carb totals.

I hope that helps.

Cheers

[KSUmom]

I have been low carbing for about four years now. I lost about 140 lbs in about a year and a half on about 40-50 carbs a day with a occasional cheat of 75 carbs in a day. The main rule of mine was no more than 30 carbs at one time. I found the sweet spot of where my blood sugar would shoot up was at that point. For me I had to play around until I found the right amount of carbs that would keep the weight loss going and that I also felt good.

[Tredos]

I've been low carb for about 15 years. Under 10g net carbs to get into ketosis and under 20 to keep weight loss going. Under 50 for maintenance. Recently I've gone keto-adapted, under 20g every day, upping my fat intake to maintain weight and balancing protein only at maintenance levels. I feel great. I've always had plenty of energy, no fogginess. I'm 52 and have been intermittent fasting for 35 years. I just feel better when I don't eat until noon.

[FancyEyes2222]

I follow a low-carb (Keto) diet, you can add me on MFP

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/profile/catwoman8888

check out this website for more info on Keto:

www.reddit.com/r/keto