GoBe: the fitbit killer?

[Volnaiskra]

I've been a user and fervent lover of my fitbit One for the past 18 months, so a part of me feels bad about posting about a [potential] competitor here. But I just saw the IndieGogo page for the GoBe, and it looks extremely interesting:

http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/healbe-gobe-the-only-way-to-automatically-measure-calorie-intake

If it works as they claim it does, it will be amazing: fully automated recording of calories, activity, sleep, stress-levels, and more, all done through contact with your skin - no more manual logging.

The IndieGoGo crowdfunding target has been well and truly met, but you can still contribute and/or preorder a unit if you want, using the above url.

[Odyssey13]

IF is the word. $299, plus tax and shipping and that's for a first generation product. That thing is huge and the band uses the same clasp as the Force or Flex. How is charging done?

I don't see how any one device could do as that one suggests.

[Volnaiskra]

It doesn't look any bigger than my watch. 300 bucks (which includes shipping and probably tax too, btw) is a lot. But then again, if this thing cost much less than that, I'd be suspicious of its quality. My fitbit was about half of that, and it only has half the functions.

Apparently they've already demo'ed the product at CES2014. Sounds like the hardware and even the app already exist. The campaign money is just for additional software development, and for the cost of mass manufacturing.

I haven't read any reviews, but I'm assuming the demo was sufficiently impressive. But I'm only assuming. There are probably reviews available though if you google.

Unlike Kickstarter, which uses Amazon payments, IndieGoGo uses regular credit card or Paypal. Also unlike Kickstarter (which only charges if a campaign is successful), you get charged immediately, and refunded if the campaign fails (which won't happen here because the campaign has already raised 6x more than necessary at time of writing).

edit: oh, when you said charging I realise you meant charging the battery. It seems that there's a little usb dock, and I think I read that the battery lasts 2-3 days. 

[vinlop]

That device is quite large and not very attractive.  For a wearable like this, you would have to be committed to wearing it all the time.  For me, my Fitbit Force is sleek, and way more stylish than this device.  The additional functionality it brings would be nice, but it would have to be in a better looking package to be used everyday.  I'll continue to log my additional data until something better I can live with comes out.

[Volnaiskra]

I get the concerns about the style of the thing, but I just don't get the concerns about its size. Many/most of us wear watches that we are "commited to wearing all the time", and all those things do is merely tell the time. 

Everyone's different, I guess. I never take off my watch during sleep, excercise, sex, shower, etc, and my watch is bulkier than the GoBe. So swapping it for this thing is a no-brainer. Though if you really love your watch and wouldn't want to part with it - or if you don't wear a watch in the first place - then that's a different story I guess.

[Mary]

It looks like the Body Media and Basis bands that have been out for a while, and the wrist-based phone thingies that Samsung and Motorola have and Apple has been developing.  

I don't wear a watch and haven't since I began carrying cell phones decades ago.  I would never wear that  thing.  I bought a Flex and took it back after a day because it was too big and ugly for me.  I don't know anyone who wears watches anymore, to be honest, not that they're gone but they seem to be a fashion accessory for most..  

Fitbit has a lot of competitors- the Withings Pulse, Jawbone UP, Fitbug, the two above, Amiigo supposed to be out soon, Misfit Shine, Polar Loop, Nike Fitband and others.  I researched them all before buying my latest Fitbit in Nov. and none of them are quite what I want. 

I'm suspicious of their claims and that calorie intake estimator from the skin.  They use a lot of "precisely" and "accurately" and "calculates" there.  Besides the skin glucose thing which I have no idea about, the rest of their tools are all rough estimators that are in use in other products.   I'm guessing it's going to be a very rough estimate of calorie intake, probably rougher than the output of body fat scales or the Fitbit altimeter.  

I'd also be suspicious of their claim that they could have them for sale by June.  They just started crowd funding this month and have only recently shown a prototype.  The Amiigo's crowd funding ended a year ago and it's still not to market.  I think Fitbits took about a year from their first CES show to general sales, too.  

LG, Garmin, Razer, Pebble and Sony's new wearable devices were also at CES this year.  The Pebble Steel is the only one I'd wear.  

http://www.techradar.com/us/news/portable-devices/the-wearable-tech-that-got-pulses-racing-at-ces-20...

[Jim_M]

The garmin vivofit is also out now, and the device itself is close to a force, but doesn't do stairs or alarms.  It does however have a display that's on all the time (like a watch), has a way to let you know if you've been inactive too long, an optional HRM and batteries that only nned to replaced once a year.  The dashboard is laking a few things like integration to MFP, but that's expected to be in the works.  And it's the same price as the Force sold for ($20 more if you want the HRM band)

[LindaS]

I don't see how this could work correctly to determine calories ingested. It says that it determines that by your glucose levels.

But glucose levels are lowered when you drink alcohol, and alcohol actually adds a lot of calories to your diet. This link explains what can lower and raise glucose levels.  http://www2.estrellamountain.edu/academics/physed/wellness/diet_diabetes.html

I just don't see how a skin reading can be accurate and take all of the possible variations/reasons into account when determining glucose levels. 

[Jim_M]

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@LindaS wrote:

I don't see how this could work correctly to determine calories ingested. It says that it determines that by your glucose levels.

But glucose levels are lowered when you drink alcohol, and alcohol actually adds a lot of calories to your diet. This link explains what can lower and raise glucose levels.  http://www2.estrellamountain.edu/academics/physed/wellness/diet_diabetes.html

I just don't see how a skin reading can be accurate and take all of the possible variations/reasons into account when determining glucose levels. 

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I'd expect the data to be bad if you are diabetic and on meds (or even undiagnosed pre diabetic)

[RickSTer1100]

I would take a guess that VOLNAISKRA is just a troll from the company.  The only posts from VOLNAISKRA are recent and regards to this new unreleased product only.  Seems like a cheap way for this upstart company to try to get exposure.  I would suggest just ignoring this thread and letting it die.

[slysam]

I've seen this and am curious. I am unsure how accurate it can be either. I don't see myself wearing it all the time, if it proves to accurately figure calories burned and the price point were low enough I could see getting one if it would work to wear it around or after meal times. It looks similar but different than body media--it uses heart rate (body media does not as heart rate doesn't necessarily reflect non aerobic calorie burn. BM uses movement, perspiration and body temperature. I don't have BM but tend to believe you can infer metabolism from bodytemp more than from heart rate as most of our BMR calories are regulating body temperature. It sounds like this uses heart rate and accelerometer for calorie burn estimate. I am not convinced this would be that accurate for non-exercise, though maybe for exercise.) I think it goes in the "we'll see" category just like the dozens of other activity trackers on kickstarter and similar that haven't come out yet. I am quite interested in some that claim to be able to recognize specific exercises and count reps and even learn others. If they work well, I will probably get one of the rep counting devices for workout wear (all the new trackers look to bulky for my taste--I don't see abandoning my Fitbit One yet). The estimation of calories eaten and hydration is unique--but right now the only source of accuracy information comes from the developer. I will want to see more reviews. I do sort of believe they may be able to determine hydration levels, but for the reasons mentioned am unsure I believe glucose levels will be that accurate for total calorie burn. It is interesting though!

[slysam]

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@Jim_M wrote:

The garmin vivofit is also out now, and the device itself is close to a force, but doesn't do stairs or alarms.  It does however have a display that's on all the time (like a watch), has a way to let you know if you've been inactive too long, an optional HRM and batteries that only nned to replaced once a year.  The dashboard is laking a few things like integration to MFP, but that's expected to be in the works.  And it's the same price as the Force sold for ($20 more if you want the HRM band)

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I keep looking at the new trackers even though I am mostly happy with Fitbit. This doesn't appeal to me because I don't have any Garmin devices and don't want a wrist worn device. But I can see it may be very useful and interesting to people who already use Garmin products as they may prefer having their activity data in the same place as their workout data. I think it is interesting Garmin and Polar both introduced trackers around the same time. It looks like Garmin likely did a better job of it (though I haven't seen enough reviews yet). I looked at Polar Flow as I use Polar heart rate monitors, but I found it seems very lacking in the features I want as well as that it is a wrist worn device. I do think the lack of integration is a big issue, but my impression is Garmin is more likely to allow integration while Polar doesn't very often. I think all the possible integrations is really one of fitbit's greatest strengths.

[slysam]

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@LindaS wrote:

I don't see how this could work correctly to determine calories ingested. It says that it determines that by your glucose levels.

But glucose levels are lowered when you drink alcohol, and alcohol actually adds a lot of calories to your diet. This link explains what can lower and raise glucose levels.  http://www2.estrellamountain.edu/academics/physed/wellness/diet_diabetes.html

I just don't see how a skin reading can be accurate and take all of the possible variations/reasons into account when determining glucose levels. 

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Wow! Off topic but very interesting. Once I had an elevated fasted glucose test that labelled me as "pre-diabetic" (and was fine in tests before and after this one). The conditions, the test was 8am, I walked 1 mile to get to the pharmacy to take the test, it was a day or so after ovulation. I had asked the pharmacist if any of those can make a difference and was told "no" if anything they would all make my glucose levels lower. I hadn't heard of the Dawn Phenomenon before. But when my GP tested me afterwards at a different cycle phase and with no pre-test exercise it was in "normal" ranges.

[Dominique]

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@RickSTer1100 wrote:

I would take a guess that VOLNAISKRA is just a troll from the company.  The only posts from VOLNAISKRA are recent and regards to this new unreleased product only.  Seems like a cheap way for this upstart company to try to get exposure.  I would suggest just ignoring this thread and letting it die.

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The best way for him to prove you wrong would be to make the starting date on profile visible to all, just like it is on mine, for instance:

I'm not convinced by the promises related to the heart rate monitoring capabilities:

There is already one tracker that claims to do this (the Basis B1 Band) and plenty of reports say it doesn't work properly.

However, I'd be ready to buy it for its calorie intake measuring capabilities, assuming they are somewhat reliable. I'll wait until it's commercially available and will let others be guinea pigs.

[Mary]

The glucose thing is suspicious to me because isn't your blood glucose level very dependent on what sort of foods you eat, not the calorie level?  That's the whole glycemic index thing, isn't it?  You can eat a hearty, low carb meal that has little effect on blood sugar level but has 800 calories but a 250 calorie candy or baked potato sends your blood sugar off on a spike, right?  

[Volnaiskra]

Here you go RICKSTER1100, I just changed my profile setting to show that I've been here since 2012. Is that enough for you, RICKSTER1100? And even if I was from the company, how would that change anything anyway, RICKSTER1100?

_____

I've always thought people who ditched their watches once they got cell phones are crazy. It takes them about 20 times longer to find the time than it takes me. There's a reason why wristwatches made pocket watches obsolete, you know. But yeah, if you hate wearing something on your wrist so much that you put up with using your cellphone for time, then a product like this is obviously not for you. Even I had no interest in the Flex, even though it was often touted as an upgrade to my One.

_______

Some valid points have been made above, regarding readings from glucose etc. Thoguh I suspect that the glycemic index of foods *may* not be too much of a problem if the product is smart about how it looks at the pattern of glucose over longer periods of time. A spike caused by eating a handful of jellybeans will turn into a lull once the overcompensation of insulin kicks in. That spike/dip pattern should in theory be easy to differentiate (and account for) from the more steady pattern after eating a low-GI food that creates a slow-release of glucose

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I've already pre-ordered mine. When it arrives, I'll use it in conjunction with fitbit, and see how it compares. If the calorie estimates are at all similar, I'll be ditching the fitbit. 

In addition to logging all of my food, I have to log almost all of my excercise, because it's 90% cycling and weight-lifting, so fitbit can't track it automatically. It gets tedious, and after a year+ of doing it, I barely even bother to log it anymore. The GoBe has to be more accurate than that!