Is riding a bike on challenge cheating?

[MeredithC]

I did a work week challenge and one day I hiked 2.5 miles then did a 12 mile bike ride.  One of the people said I was cheating.  I think working out is working out.  A bike logs less steps than actually stepping.  What do you think?  BTW this person won the challenge 'cause he paced around the house until midnight.  I think that's a little compulsive just to win.

[sunshine923]

Well thank god for me not seeking anyone's approval.

[MeredithC]

I like your answer. I'm doing this for exercise but the person i do the challenges is very very competitive and feels he needs to win. I stopped syncing my fitbit except for every 24 hours so he couldn't see what i was doing. Drove him nuts.

[MeredithC]

I like your answer. I'm doing this for exercise but the person i do the challenges is very very competitive and feels he needs to win. I stopped syncing
my fitbit except for every 24 hours so he couldn't see what i was doing. Drove him nuts. I guess we just need to agree to the terms. I find i get about 30 percent less steps on the bike with the fitbit in my pocket.

[SunsetRunner]

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@shipo wrote:

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@WendyB wrote:

I does not matter how you get your steps. I have heard this about others things to like the elliptical. I don't get it. Steps are Steps

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Prior to logging on to these community forums I would have said the same thing.  That said, I have since learned "Steps" in many cases are not in fact, "steps".  Compare and contrast the following (which statement do you consider true):

• Steps are steps, regardless of whether the stepper is walking/jogging in place, or running a 5-minute mile up a 10% grade.
• Not all steps are created equal.

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you are presuming that everyone jogging in place in front of the tv is doing small steps, now, for those that are doing small steps then yes I would agree with you, but at the end of the day, to do so just to win a challenge is just cheating themselves, but to group everyone into the same category is just daft

are you saying that you have never ever jogged/ran in place when the weather was pouring it down and instead waited until the weather was fine before going out? I'm pretty sure that you have, unless the weather where you are is better than up here in Yorkshire

so by your reckoning, if someone were to complete say a challenge by doing their steps running down a mountain then they are cheating as they have gravity helping them

or if they completed it at night when it is cooler they are cheating

the only way for a challenge to be 100% equal is for all contestants to do it together at the same place and time, which is pretty much impossible

in which case, why are you here, as all the challenges you are doing are not 100% equal, so by doing them you are accepting the fact that not all challenges are equal, so you are contradicting youself

or are you saying that the challenges that you do are with people right next to you and do them at the same time?

so if I were to jog up a mountain this weekend, I have every right to call you a liar and that your steps are not real, because not all steps are created equal and that the steps that I did were far more difficult than yours?

what about those that do their steps on a walking/running machine, are their steps 'real'

how is jogging on the spot different to a running machine, infact, a running machine is going to be easier as you have the belt propelling you

as for fake steps, I think my weighing scale would disagree with you, 29lbs lost in nearly 4 weeks

yes some do cheat, but in my case, I know for a fact that I am not, whether you agree or not, well that is your opinion, you are entiitled to it

have you even tried a non electrical elliptical walking machine, as all your steps are done by you, no motor to help you, it might be just me, but it is harder than running be it outside or on a running machine, rowing machine, jogging on the spot etc

100 steps done running outside will burn less than 100 steps on the elliptical walking machine

with the elliptical, those 100 steps are not just 100 steps, it is a full body workout

not to mention I have yet to come across a GPS device that is 100% accurate, so some of your steps are also fake then, for 100% accurate step count is to count those steps yourself, even pedomenters are not 100% accurate, as for distance because the GPS device is not 100% accurate, the distance done is not 100% accurate, close maybe

the only way for the distance to be 100% accurate is to draw the exact line you ran, and then measure it

which means, all those steps and distance that you claim to have done? are not 100% accurate, just because they are GPS doesn't mean they are 100% accurate

I'm sure many of us has a tomtom or similar gps tracking device, how many times has it gone funny and thought you were heading straight forward when you have turned off? or other things like that?  the only difference with the fitbit is that you can not see it go funny

anyway, doesn't matter anymore as I no longer jog in place, to much strain on the ankles and the arch of the foot, not to mention kinda hard watching movies etc on the ipad when your head is bouncing up and down, I now ride on an exercise bike, still playing with the hardness setting to find the right difficulty, so that I can get a good workout, but not tiring myself out too quick, but not too easy so that it was a waste £250, no more sore ankle, just a sore bum.....

[scrapper12]

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@shipo wrote:

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@Lily-Mari wrote:

biking is not "fake" steps, biking is excercising, you can log it in the dashboard.

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Please understand, I was not referring to steps converted from biking; I was referring more to "steps" logged from doing stuff like jogging in place in front of the TV.

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Um well we jog in place in bootcamp when we are stuck inside because of weather. It's exercise and thats what the fit bit is all about!!! Keeping you motivated to keep you moving no matter how you move.

[WendyB]

I only join challenges of people I really know.

Several locals each week do a Workweek hustle and the a weekend one, we all know each other.

A friend that I don't really know I decline. They tend to be boring. No one talks. These are really boring.

I would rather be in a challenge where people talk and have fun. You don't talk forget it  But that's me. I have quit several when they dont talk and have a good time. Its not a challenge

[SunsetRunner]

I rather be in a challenge with people who jog in place etc than be in a challenge with people who obviously lower their goal just so that they win

to me I just don't understand, does winning really mean that much to some people? I rather lose knowing I did my best and pushed myself as hard as I could have, than win by cheating

[GershonSurge]

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@MeredithC wrote:
I like your answer. I'm doing this for exercise but the person i do the challenges is very very competitive and feels he needs to win. I stopped syncing
my fitbit except for every 24 hours so he couldn't see what i was doing. Drove him nuts. I guess we just need to agree to the terms. I find i get about 30 percent less steps on the bike with the fitbit in my pocket.

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To be clear, you don't get ANY steps on a bicycle. The fact that the Fitbit may log steps doesn't make them steps in the same way calling a tail a leg doesn't give a dog five legs. No matter what you call it, it's still a tail.

Running in place is a legitimate way to get steps on a pedometer, so I consider them steps. Depending on the intensity, it can be as hard as walking or jogging.

Pedometers were popularized to count random steps as we do things around the house, so I consider them steps. 

For some reason you seem offended by a person who wants to compete against people who are only logging steps in a step challenge. What's up with that? What's wrong with wanting to win a challenge where steps are only steps?

If you hid your numbers from me, I'd change my time zone so my day ended much later than yours. That way, when you are done, I could catch you. (Insert devil face.)

[SunsetRunner]

if they are not steps then what are they? last time I looked, they did the same motion as a step

and depending on the setting, could be tougher than your regular step, if I set the difficulty to max, it would be like pushing a car by yourself

what about elliptical cross trainers?

walking/running machines?

under the desk walkers?

and what about when it is pouring it down? do you gps people still go out jogging/running?

[JohnRi]

Actually I have rain gear I wear when it rains so I can walk with my Surge and MP3 player. I walked in the rain three days this week. Walking/running machines are just walking/running with assistance. Most people that use them and go walking in the real world find it much harder to walk a trail than a treadmill.

Desk walkers would not register on most fitbit's.

I personally think riding a bike is much harder than walking or running. But you burn fewer calories doing it than walking.

Bottomline it's all exercise. That's all that matters.

[GershonSurge]

John and Wytey,

I've been watching your profiles, and I admire how much exercise both of you are doing. 

The question is, "Is riding a bike on a challenge cheating?" I'm presuming it's a step challenge. I haven't entered any of them. If it's not a step, then it's not a step. It doesn't matter if it's more work or not.

If we three were to enter a challenge together, I'd compare calories burned with some sort of adjustment for basic metabolic rate. Even that is suspect, as calories record differently on different trackers.

It's not my fault that I consider that steps in a step challenge should be steps. I suggest contacting Fitbit and asking them for a calorie challenge with adjustments for BMR.  

On the other side, I don't care anymore what others do except to applaud their successes. I am in some activity groups in my other account (Gershon), but except for one of them, I don't keep track of my ranking. Along with a running goal, I have a goal of burning 4,000 calories a day as recorded by my Surge. 

[SunsetRunner]

depends on the difficulty setting if an exercise bike, and if a normal bike, how flat the road is etc

i.e. if set to say 125% difficulty (25% harder) compared to riding on a flat road

or 100% difficulty (normal) compared to riding up hill

I sometimes walk to the local Tesco, about 30 min walk away, and I am fine, even though it is all uphill, yet at the difficulty setting I have on the exercise bike, I am sweating like a pig after 30 mins, which steps then would you say were more diffcult?

the only real way to 'accurately' and 'fairly' compare/compete is to do the exact same thing at the same time as everyone else in the challenge, conditions are also a factor, doing 25k when it is cool is easier than doing it when it is boiling hot

it is like marathon runners accusing others of cheating or their times are not accurate because they ran in a cooler temperature

i.e. someone saying that they are faster than Usain Bolt because they ran 10.50s, and even though it is 0.01 second slower, they ran in a hotter temperature, and that if they had ran in the same temp or cooler, they would have been faster than him, or that Usain is cheating because he ran in a cooler temperature, or that the track was not 100% level, and that the track was slightly sloping downhill

a step is a step, unless you say attach it to your horse's leg, swing it on a rope etc

even if it is a gps model, doesn't mean the steps recorded is real, you could just attach it to your ankle when you ride, it would still count the steps, it will still have the gps data showing the route you took

it seems to me like some people are just arguing just for the sake of it

someone leading a busy life is not going to have the same amount of time to get steps in as someone who does not have a busy life

I could for example, wake up at 8am, start walking no stop, except to go to the toilet, cook, eat etc until I go to bed at around midnight, walk at 2 steps per second and do around 100800 steps, granted not much of a day/life, for someone that is fit, jog/run at say 4 steps per second and do around 210600 steps

I wake up around 8am and go to sleep around midnight, that leaves me with 16 hours to technically do what I I want if I wanted to, and if I was healthy enough to walk/jog/run/cycle those 16 hours, but like everyone else, I have other things to do, just like some people have to go to work, look after the kids etc

so to do 50k, I need to walk/jog/run/cycle for 7hours out of those 16 hours, now considering my average is around 30k, that is about 4.5hrs out of the whole day, which isn't exactly a lot when I have 16 hours spare as it were

I hate it when it rains and tend to stay indoors unless I really need to go out

[GershonSurge]

Wytey,

It doesn't matter which is more difficult. If it's not a step, it doesn't meet the challenge's criteria. That doesn't mean it's not good exercise.

The "steps" on an exercise bikes are not steps no matter how much work they are. 

My answer is specific to the question asked in the title of this thread. 

Are there people doing what we both would consider cheating? Certainly. Am I going to worry about it? Certainly not. I've set other goals that bypass the issue.

[SunsetRunner]

looking at your profile

yesterday you did

26737 steps burning 3529 calories

I did

35628 steps burning 4101 calories

but seeing as my Fitbit is a One, the calories burnt is not 100% accurate but based on my height, weight, age etc that I have put in the settings

what I am saying is that walking requires you to lift one leg, then the other, just like riding a bike, which I am now doing, instead of doing the so called 'fake' steps from jogging on the spot, but like I said, not everyone has the health to do so or can go out walking/running

define fake steps, walking, running, cycling requires you to lift one leg then the other, the only difference is the amount of effort required, but then if you start comparing effort required, then doing the steps at night would be fake then, because it is cooler than the day, or that doing them in the winter is fake because it is cooler, or going down hill is fake because it is easier than flat or uphill

maybe an obese person could accuse a healthy person as cheating because their steps are harder to do than them, even calories, a step done by an obese person would require more calories than a healthy person

I can not go out alone, so if I wanted to go out walking/jogging/running, someone needs to go with me, so because of my health, does that mean that instead of doing my so called 'fake' steps, I should just sit on the couch at home watching tv? which is what go me into the state that I am in

as for contacting Fitbit, I think you have it the wrong way round, it is people those that accuse others that needs to contact Fitbit, as it is people like them that has a problem with steps from jogging on the spot, cycling etc, the majority of Fitbit users do not have a problem with it

for the majority of users, the Fitbit is a device to help them lose weight and have a bit of fun, if I cared, then I would have bought the Surge HR, but I don't which is why I got the Zip and now the One, all I am really bothered about is to start eating healthily and get back into shape, if I win a few challenges on the way, great, if not, and I don't win most of the challenges that I am in, then so be it, it is not the end of the world, I am still losing weight

at the end of the day, you can not be 100% certain that other people are not cheating unless are all doing those same steps, at the same time, at the same place together

it is great that you can go out running etc, but for some of us, we have to get those steps in, burn those calories anyway we can, and no I am not saying that no one is cheating, I am sure some are, even those with the Surge

like I said, just because the device has HR and GPS, does not mean you are not cheating, you could attach it to a horse's leg for example and go trotting, you would have done no steps, yet the device will log you as doing steps and GPS show where you have gone, but because the data shows you as having done x amount of steps etc, does that mean those steps are real then?

the only real goal I have is calories, although I have my steps set to 30k min, it is because that is approx the amount of steps I need to do to burn the amount of calories I need to lose weight, all it means for me is if I want to lose weight, I need to do more steps, if I want to pig out or eat more, then I need to do more steps

I just hope that you people stay healthy and not end up in the same boat as me, and have to get your steps in anyway you can, because if that day ever comes, then you will know exactly what I am thinking right now

what is the other Fitbit that you have? I presume you have tested it against the Surge? how different were the steps etc?

I would love to get the Surge, but not being able to work, I don't exactly have money to through around

heck, Special K had a promotion where they gave you a wristband pedometer, granted, it wasn't a Fitbit, and probably a cheap poc, but when I walked to my local Tesco's and wore both it and the One, it was around 1-2% out, yet when I jogged on the spot, they were pretty close, worse when checking when leaving, I presume the difference was made worse from pushing the trolley

[SunsetRunner]

when cycling and using under the desk walkers etc, for the clip on fitbits, attaching it to the groin area seems to be best, and I presume for the wrist ones, the ankle would be best

[shipo]

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@SunsetRunner wrote:

and what about when it is pouring it down? do you gps people still go out jogging/running?

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Yes, and when it is after dark and/or snowing as well; here's what it looked like last winter during one of my 10-mile runs where the trail crosses under a freeway:

[GershonSurge]

Wytey,

What you do is strenuous and admirable. But it isn't steps for a step challenge. 

Yes, I go out in the snow, too.

[GershonSurge]

I also go out when it's so cold the river is steaming.

[SunsetRunner]

a little off topic, what about wheel chair bound users, are they doing fake steps? no different from a bicycle, just using your arms instead of legs, or is it because they are disabled then it is allowed

take my dad for example, he is now in a wheelchair, does that mean that the steps he used to do where 'real' but now they are 'fake'

just like jogging on the spot whilst watching tv, and pacing around the living room whilst watching tv, the only difference is that pacing around, you are moving

some call them fake steps cheating, but the fact is, a step is a step no matter how it is done, no matter how much you argue, whether it is cheating or not is defined by whether it is stated in the rules or not, not how it is done

so for those to say that everyone that jogs on the spot, cycle etc in all challenges are cheating is just plain daft and single minded, maybe even selfish, you do not speak for everyone, just yourself

if you are bothered by it, then join challenge's where it is stated that so called 'real' steps are only allowed, or create your own challenge and disallow it

for the majority of FitBit users, it is a device to help them lose weight, and the challenges are just for fun and a little competition to help them lose weigh and make friends, not everyone takes it seriously etc, just like in a marathon, some will do it wearing the full gear, time themselves etc, but the majority do not, this is like them calling those that do not lazy etc, just because you take it seriously, and join challenge's where it is serious, not even one does

I do not join challenge's where it is stated that it is not allowed, so as far as I am concerned, as well as the others in the challenges I participate in, I am not cheating, nor are those that also use an exercise bike, jog on the spot etc in the challenge's that I am in

now if I were to join in a challenge that disallows it, then yes I will be cheating

do some people cheat? yes, that is something that can not be avoided

heck, just because it is stated in the rules, it does not mean that some are not cheating, just because it has GPS means nothing, you could just attach it to your horse's leg for example and go trotting, you can never be 100% certain that no-one is cheating

but the reality is, unless it is stated in the rules, then no it is not cheating, that is what the rules are for

at the end of the day, everyone has an opinion, what matters is what you think, not others, but don't go round calling people cheats, they may have broken the rules in the challenges you are in, but that does not mean they have broken the rules in the challenges that they are in

if you personally think that it is cheating, then create a challenge that does not allow it or join challenge's where it is not allowed, FitBit have sold millions, more likely billions of FitBits, the percentage of people that are bothered by it is minute compared to those that are not

so to answer the topic's question, unless it was stated in the rules, then no

[SunsetRunner]

like I said, great that you can go outside and walk, jog, run etc

but not everyone can, as I said, due to medical reasons, I can not, so I have to get my steps in anyway I can, be in on an exercise bike, jogging on the spot, pacing around whilst waiting for the microwave

or are all users that are disabled all cheating?

like I said, unless it is stated in the rules, then we are not cheating, the challenges that I join do not state it, heck, most do not even have any, all the ones I join are just for fun, banter and making friends and to lose weight, some of the winners do 100-200k steps, yet none of us are bothered, at the rate they are going, it is going to end up exchanging cooking ideas......

what about the single mothers/fathers with babies, the only way that they can get any real steppage done is by jogging on the spot, pacing around when the baby is asleep, it is not like they can just pop out for a run

like you said, if you are bothered by it then only join challenges where the rules are laid down