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Returning to Fitbit from Garmin, a painful and long road ahead.

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Just bought myself an Ionic to replace my VivoActive 3 from Garmin, mostly because Garmin is dropping support for Windows 10 Mobile and as I am not interested in iPhone or android it was easier to switch fitness trackers.  Part of me regrets that already.  I am instantly being reminded of many of the reasons I ditched fitbit in the first place. They are just generally lacking in most regards.  I am definitely open to any help or advice here.

 

  1. Watch Faces.  I miss having seconds on my watch, really how hard is it to display seconds without having to choose the most busy watch face possible. 
  2. Stairs.  Garmin tracks floors descended not just climbed.  Walking down stairs is easier on your knees and still burns more calories and works some additional muscles than just walking.  Not sure why this is hard for Fitbit.
  3. Heart Rate Zones.  Cardiologist, fitness experts, and pretty much the entire fitness industry says there are five zones, yet fitbit insists on 3 and it is a weird three.  Zone 1 and 2 are combined into the Fat burn zone  (most consider zone 1 as warm up and zone 2 as fat burn.  Then Zone 3 to 4.5 is combined into the cardio zone on fitbit.  Normally these are the cardio and hard core zones.  Most fitness experts believe hitting hard core during a work out will help you keep burning for the next several hours to day.  Yet fitbit doesn't keep it separate.  The they go from zone 4.5 to 5 as peak zone where zone 5 is typically called the max zone, it isn't something you want to stay in for an extended period but it good for pushing for personal bests.  Yet this mash up is confusing and not fitbit sticks with it even through it is not taken seriously for it.
  4. Step Tracking.  Fitbit has always been known for not being the most accurate at steps and giving users random extra steps (many think for encouragement) but is it also bad for those who move quickly or take very few steps between a desk and a printer or similar.  This is often because fitbit requires a certain amount of time before it starts tracking instead of number of steps.  This often left me with less steps than any other tracker because I am constantly getting up and going to a printer or the next office or cube.  
  5. Interface.  The interface of the devices are cumbersome and confusing.  It is never the same from device to device or even menu to menu.  Sometimes you are swiping left to right, others up and down, and other times using the buttons.  It is as if each screen was designed by a completely different team who goes out of their way to be different.  My last Garmin had one button and was so much more intuitive.  The one before that had two buttons and still much easier and a lot more consistent. 
  6. Move Notifications.  Garmin's move notifications are based 100% on your activity level and the last time you moved, calculated on the watch without need for the app at all.  Fitbit is all time based, you get the notifications at the end of the hour on the clock if you hadn't moved that hour.  The problem being if you moved enough at the start of one hour (say moving from 2pm to 2:10pm) then dont move at all for until the notification you wont get it until the end of the next hour (about 3:50pm) meaning you haven't actually moved for almost 2 hours (1 hour and 40 minutes) where as the Garmin's complain if you haven't moved for 45 minutes regardless. 
  7. Biking.  The Garmin's allowed external sensors to be attached to my bike so it didn't just assume my effort based on pulse or speed it would check the sensor on my pedal to know if I was actually pedaling or just coasting (every bike rider coasts on hills) to help me more accurately calculate calories.
  8. Calories.  Fitbit scored the lowest in recent university tests for calorie accuracy.  Even low than the now discontinued for several years Microsoft band (the original not the second edition) which I am not even sure how they found one to test.  Then again as they are known to over estimate steps to make people feel better calories burned shouldn't be a surprise. 
  9. Dynamic Step Goals.  Fitbit defaults to 10k steps stated the American Heart Association recommends it.  Which is kind of true.  They don't recommend starting with that as your goal however (neither do most fitness experts and doctors) as it can actually be dangerous to immediately increase to that level.  Garmin allowed for dynamic step goals to beat yesterday and while also taking into account average steps previously to try to encourage you to do more.  If you only do 2,000-3,000 steps a day it is neither safe or reasonable to try for 10,000 and the device should adapt to your needs not some set random number.  The AHA also recommends 10 floors a day in addition to the 10k steps, yet Fitbit which holds them in such high regard as to twist their words doesn't let you set both goals.  Fitbit has a goal of 30 minutes a day for Activity minutes which also the recommended, in a way.  It isn't recommended to do it 7 days a weeks.  Generally it is recommend to do 30 minutes a day 3-5 days a week (or 150 minutes a week)  as your body does need rest.  I was hoping more of these would improve over the years since I abandoned my Surge.
  10. Exercise Shortcut Limit.  Garmin's are not limited to 7 (I think my Surge was limited to 8 but the ionic is seven).  If you are going to limit it to such a small number things like Walk, Run, and Treadmill should be combined into a single shortcut that prompts you for type of walk/run upon entering the exercise. And Fitbit should make more specific descriptions about what each shortcut is used for, many seem to be identical except for names which are somewhat generic and ambiguous.
  11. Generic Strength and Cardio apps.  The strength app was great for every day exercises like pushups, sit-ups, lifting, planks, and about any fitness equipment out there with weights.  I would put it on it would automatically count reps (for more exercises, it had trouble with leg curls and extensions but then my arm wasn't moving). I could enter the weight and it would even automatically figure out most excises and the ones it didn't i could set from the app.  Fitbit doesn't let you log these types of exercises in any helpful way associated with heart rate or calories.  And pretty much all of the ones I listed are "custom" exercises not found in the list (seriously how does anything related to fitness not know what a pushup is?). 
  12. Cadence.  Garmin would track my run cadence (steps per minute) during outdoor runs, indoor runs, and treadmill.  In addition to Pace, average pace, distance, heart rate, time spent in HR zones, max hr, average hr, and even average stride length.  (I guess it is more about run details than just cadence.  I also know I have talked about multiple external sensors related to biking and how it tracks similar and not even getting into the run or biking power measurements because those require more expensive special sensors.
  13. Moderate vs Vigorous Activity Minutes.  The AHA, CDC, and WHO all agree that adults should have 150 minutes of moderate activity or 75 minutes of Vigorous activity per week.  Fitbit treats these both the same and sets a daily goal by default of 30 minutes a day for every day of the week (or 210 minutes a week) which may be too much for some people and doesn't provide a day of rest and recovery.  Most other trackers use weekly instead of daily goals or combine the two and treat vigorous minutes of activity as two times that of moderate minutes of activity.

 

As I am writing this I am really questioning my decision just to be able to sync with my phone instead of my computer.  Syncing with the computer did keep it charged too, though it had twice the battery life of the ionic. I will give the ionic a try though, after all haven't even had it for 6 hours yet.  

 

<Note>Edited to clean up and use bullet points for easier reading. Also Added linked to feature requests related to my issues. 

<Note>Moved items from next days post into this post for consistency.  Only items 1-8 were in the first 6 hours.  9-12 were still within the first 24 hours but technically the next day.

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As previously stated there are some things Fitbit does do better than other trackers.  It does have one of the better sleep tracking of all the devices, well above Garmin, especially when set to sensitive.  Though still not up to the now defunct Basis.  My Basis B1 tracked better than anything else I have used and that was about 3-4 years ago and it was their older model.

 

Fitbit also integrates into more sites and apps than just about other tracker out there, which is a welcome change.  Garmin is very closed. It could connect to ShapeUp and VirginPulse for company step challenges and would connect to MyFitnessPal but that is probably only because they didn't have their own food database for calories intake. Then just Strava.  Everything else besides social media was closed off and made it difficult to do anything outside their ecosystem.  So in that regard Fitbit blows them away.  

 

Support and product quality is about on par with Garmin, both Fitbit and Garmin replaced devices for me. And both had many software and app issues that they worked to improve in the past.  Now Garmin dropped support for Windows 10 Mobile forcing me to switch and the Windows 10 app for Fitbit actually works quiet well.

 

Fitbit is also better than Garmin in the ability to support multiple trackers on an account.  Steps can sync bi-directionally.  With Garmin if you have a second track both have their own step count and syncing does not add them together. If you use one in the morning and switch to another it doesn't matter until that second tracker has as many steps as the first.  Even more annoying when switching to a replacement device or factory resetting.  Fitbit instead downloads the already synced data to the second or reset device so you dont lose anything.  Definitely better.

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Thanks for the list! Most items are general Dashboard features (not Ionic specific) that I've wanted to see from Fitbit.

 

Unfortunately Microsoft has dropped future support for Windows 10 Mobile, so perhaps it is a good idea to reconsider syncing with a computer.

Aria, Fitbit MobileTrack on iOS. Previous: Flex, Force, Surge, Blaze

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@bbarrera  I was syncing with my computer for my Garmin for a couple months when the App stopped working for allowing me to sync and only let me view my data.  The desktop app for Garmin got very slow and had a number of issues and I lost out on  the smart watch functionality.  Finally I had issues with the device and Garmin wanted to replace with another one in the Forerunner or Fenix series at an additional cost to me.  So I gave up and came back to Fitbit.  Fitbit has said they are going to continue to support Windows 10 mobile for a while, and Microsoft is supporting it for at least two more years.  They should have Windows 10 on Arm by then and the UWP apps should carry over so it is almost annoying that people are giving up on the universal apps because that hurts desktop too.  

 

The reason I posted this in Ionic is because several of the things I would like are only likely to be Ionic capable such as external sensors because the Ionic already supports pairing with Bluetooth devices (other than phones and computers).  And while many others do involve dashboard changes they would also involve a device update which only the newer devices are likely to get.  The other semi new device doesn't even have an altimeter for stairs.  If Fitbit is going to make the improvements it would be to FitbitOS which they are likely to carry over to future devices.  And if there is a work around for some of these things it would likely be in a third party app that only the Ionic really supports.  Third party is how I got around my watch face issue. 

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@SunsetRunner With regard to your request to add seconds to the clock. I just downloaded the Trekkie watch and besides it being extremely cool (especially if you are a Trekkie) it has seconds on the clock. 

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I saw those (there are two).  Just disappointed there isn't a Fitbit made clock face for me.  The third party ones sometimes have issues.  And seem slower. 

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@SunsetRunnerwrote:

I saw those (there are two).  Just disappointed there isn't a Fitbit made clock face for me.  The third party ones sometimes have issues.  And seem slower. 


 Fair enough. I am giving the first ‘Trekkie’ clock a go- I like the graphs and the volume of information, but doesn’t look cluttered - Just hope it’s easy on battery. 

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Hi, Scarab,

I checked out Ambient. It's pretty cool. I like Clear Beam too. I agree that it would be nice for Fitbit to support these new ones, but the guys that created both of these are very helpful. My husband has the Trek one. It makes me dizzy.

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Does anyone know an app that lets you track details of your workout such as exercises and reps?  This is probably going to end up as another bullet point.  This transition is just painful and made that much more painful by the now third contact I have made to support since Saturday.  This time because my exercise does not show me recorded peak minutes even though the graph shows my heart rate was above the bpm needed for peak (and the device and app showed peak during the exercise), it doesn't even change that part of the graphs color to the peak color.  Yet I was told to restart the watch even though the dashboard has the correct data recorded just not displaying correctly.  (Sorry venting)

 

Back on topic, I could really use an app to track my workouts if I am going to continue with Fitbit.  My previous Garmin's would count reps for me prompt me for weight in addition to guessing what exercise I am doing.  While I can deal with this being more manual I still need at least some of that data. 

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Considering I haven't found a great way to track reps or other exercises (there is one app but didn't really fit and doesn't save the data for any length of time).  I tried a fit coaching workout.  I didn't realize you needed accessories for these so I found myself scrambling for a box to do steps on or something to lean against for bench dips.  The info tells you the list of activities but I didn't notice those and it doesn't tell you things you will need.  I did it in a mirrored gym and needed to sprint to the other side of the room for a wall without mirrors to do a wall squat.  The advertisements make it look like there is a video with instruction, there is a brief animation but i couldn't figure out how to get back to it when I missed it once and not even audio prompts (I had my headphones paired at the time.  

 

Does anyone have any advise for these coach exercises, I know you can't add more to the watch yet but should I just be learning them over time through trial and error?  Seems to negate the entire point of coaching.  I mean yes I can pause them but only after the 5 second tutorial. Definitely open to suggestions here.  I was hoping this would help me more considering the lack of performance data for me to compare to measure improvement. 

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Update:  I replaced the Fitbit Ionic with another one at the store.  This one does more accurately count my steps. (A 100 step test walk counts 97-98 steps.)  However it is still not great at counting short walks like to the printer or the next person in a row of cubes or offices. Basically most walks only lasting 5-10 seconds.  It has also randomly counted over 20 floors on a day I didn't take the stairs and actually barely moved.  Though it was an extremely windy day so there might have been pressure issues.

 

I finally got it to sync to Strava after a short hike.  I am still very frustrated that Fitbit will not sync runs/walks/bikes without GPS (not sure about swims as GPS doesn't work well in the water).  This kind of makes sense as runs or walks without GPS dont have pace or cadence (already complained about before) but it doesn't make it less frustrating.  My Garmin would send all Walks, Runs, and Bike rides to Strava be indoors or out.  I live in the Boston area, we have this little thing called Winter (Fitbit may have heard of it considering they have an office here).  Most people are not running or biking outside with snow on the ground.  

 

I still have another few weeks to decide if I am keeping my Ionic before the return period is up.  Garmin did just update my old watch and fixes some issues I had with it, though the main reason I switched was because of the lack of a supported Windows 10 (mobile or desktop) app.  

 

Several of my requests are making headway.  Though Move Notifications has been closed for comment they are still taking Votes to see if people really want it.  The only complaint someone had for it, and I really hope they were joking, was they like being able to fit in a nap given the nearly two hours between alerts without messing with their stats.  Though more recent studies actually are moving the other way and saying an moving for 5 minutes an hour might not be enough and are recommending 3-5 mins every half hour (30 minutes). I am running late right now but will try to post a link to one of them later.  In the mean time please feel free to vote this one up: https://community.fitbit.com/t5/Feature-Suggestions/Change-Reminder-to-Move-notifications-to-be-base...

 

As for other experiences, Notifications on the new watch have been spotty.  It is annoying when the screen shuts off and sometimes wont turn on by gestures.  During a workout when I need to pause or see something i fine myself having to press the left button, which is not usually convenient.  I did try Garmin pay the other day and it worked flawlessly which was nice.  I was also able to get my BOA card added in addition to my AMEX.  

 

I am also starting to wonder why there is an Treadmill option but not a stationary bike in the exercise shortcuts.  I just turned off the GPS for Bike but I could technically just do the same for run.  

 

Battery life has been alright, but not consistent. Also on the 7th day of the week (mine is Saturday) after working out 3 days in the week out of the 5 recommended (and currently configured as the goal, yes I know I can change it).  I get a notification in the app, not on the watch, saying "Almost to your 5 day Exercise Goal! You're in it to win it.".  I find this rather confusing as it would not actually be possible to make my goal at that point.  As it is the last day of the week, I could at most only get 4 out of 5 (as 5 out of 5 would require another day before the next week starts).  This seems very buggy.   Anyone else seeing this? 

 

 

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@SunsetRunnerwrote:

Several of my requests are making headway.


@SunsetRunner Thanks for the update. Regarding feature suggestions forum, having been around here for 3+ years all I can say is 'talk is cheap.' Real headway can only be measured by enhancements in a firmware update, or Fitbit public commitment to delivering an enhancement in a future update. 

 

"Spinning" is the stationary bike mode you need to add as one of your 7 shortcuts.

 

Regarding syncing non-GPS activities... Fitbit should support it. I've got a large number of stationary bike rides in Strava, from various other tracking platforms. The newer devices from your previous tracker vendor support syncing activities via WiFi, and you can use GC in a mobile web browser. 

 

Fitbit makes activity trackers, and has a somewhat closed eco-system. You can't easily export/sync all activities, and you can't import GPS/HR/etc from a more appropriate tracker (e.g. bike computer). There is no option for foot pods (treadmill) or other ANT+/BT sensors. Notifications are really good at pushing you back to phone app. There is no speaker for audible alerts, and no microphone. The dashboard is pretty and compact, but lacking any real details.

 

If you are good with all that, then Ionic is an interesting wearable that is a work in progress. If I was still focused on steps, then Ionic looks like best Fitbit to splurge on. Charge2 and Alta HR are best overall values, in my opinion. I routinely recommend Charge2 and Alta HR to friends looking for extra motivation to move more and sit less.

 

Fitbit CEO last month is on record about rolling out a new smartwatch, to appeal to a broader audience. I always recommend evaluating any product as-is, and not hoping for enhancements that may or may not arrive. 

 

Hope that helps!

Aria, Fitbit MobileTrack on iOS. Previous: Flex, Force, Surge, Blaze

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@bbarreraI have been considering one of the Garmin Wi-Fi enabled watches.  Reached out to Garmin, and was told they need to talk with Garmin Express over Wi-Fi and don't sync directly to the cloud.  Though that may have changed as I have gotten outdated information before form all kinds of support.  If anyone has used one it would be nice to get some input.   I would also be losing notifications, though gaining Audible (with the 645) would be nice in addition to all of the other features and tracking I am losing now. I have considered the Fenix 5 Sapphire and the Forerunner 935.  The Forerunner 645 is nice but newer devices often take months to flush out.  At least on the lower end Vivo side of things.  Maybe I should just buy one and test it.  I already own the foot pod, speed and cadence sensors.  

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for gear like Fitbit, sport watches, and related electronics, I usually buy from REI using one of the 20% off coupons. The great thing about REI is the return policy. The 935 is basically the plastic version of the Fenix 5, which results in better ANT+ radio reception for cycling with power meters, cadence, and speed sensors. As far as I know, you can sync via WiFi without a phone/computer, directly to GC in the cloud without mobile app.

Aria, Fitbit MobileTrack on iOS. Previous: Flex, Force, Surge, Blaze

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I just did the exact opposite; went from an Ionic to Vivoactive 3.  I should have known better than to get the Ionic, after my previous experience with Fitbit.  Love the web-based software, found that very useful, but the build quality of Fibit always let it down, and their perpetual useless attempts to reinvent the wrist strap resulted in frequent frustration in doing the fitbit 1 strap up, and then picking it up when it had dropped off!  My fitbit 1 strap must have broken & been replaced 8 or 9 times till the pill eventually wouldn't charge.  The Ionic strap is a feat of engineering, and apparently robust with a proper buckle but no keeper loop - a stud to pop into a suitable hole in the strap. That is really hard to secure as the stud never seemed to line up properly with the right hole in the strap. Then once done up, it was prone to catching on clothing etc, and coming undone.  It had a spare strap which didn't actually fill me with confidence long-term.  I gather replacements are really expensive to buy.  I nearly took the Ionic back on day 1 - it required a firmware update.  It took nearly two days!!! Part of that was it just not being clear what was happening during the update and it just took forever.  Online research showed others had similar problems.  Eventually, after rebooting it several times, it worked.  But almost immediately it said there was another firmware update required. (possibly the same one, I don't know)  I didn't do it, after the first debacle.  In use, it was so-so and the battery duration was poor.  About 2 days.  In week 5 the display died.  It had not seen hard service, and when I took it back to Currys I wasn't inclined to replace it with another Ionic.  I looked at the Vivoactive and decided to take one of those.  Superb conventional strap, not fancy but standard design. Works well and will be easily replaceable when required.  It took a few minutes to set up in the car outside the shop and it, also, needed a firmware update which took a couple of minutes.  Battery so far, is much better than the Ionic and the display and functionality is greatly better than the Ionic's I think.  Only had it 5 days so am still assessing the data side of things.  I had to let my Windows phone go as there's no apps for it going forward, but Android's OK - not perfect but OK.  Won't go with Apple.  Have had iphones through work for years, and have a Macbook at home. Don't like iphone compared to Android which is more 'open'.   Good luck with the Ionic..

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I'm the other way, I have a 4 week old Garmin Vivoactive 4s and am desperate to go back to a Fitbit.  Happy to make swap if you want.

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Good luck with the Ionic as it has issues after the most recent update.

*. Heart monitoring is crazy (170 bpm in resting zone for me - wrong bigtime)

*. Sleep monitoring no longer works

*. Sleep scores no longer workr

Have tried all troubleshooting processes and no luck.

Called them tonight and apparently my money was wasted on the Ionic ($250) because they will not replace or refund but say since the issue is THEIR  update and "you have to wait INDEFINITELY until their next update-its been a month! (thats unfair and it makes my premium subscription useless) so I'm over Fitbit  and I wish you good luck with them, 

 

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@SunsetRunner  Ive got an ionic i will swap for your garmin

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