Many "wakeful" periods - bad sleep or is "sensitive setting" wrong for me?

[andreabrie]

I never thought I got bad sleep until I monitored my sleep with fitbit!  I consistently get sleep efficiencies in the 50-60% range and have over two hours and between 10 and 15 wakeful periods a night.  On the other hand, when I use the "normal" setting, fitbit says I slept all night without waking up and I know that's not true either.  Suggestions?  Do I need to talk to my doctor about this?

[Jabrat]

My sleep was horrible - turns out I had reflux

[ceeceham]

I bought the fitbit flex largely for the sleep tracking.  A recent sleep study ruled out sleep apnea but diagnosed me with "fragmented" sleep.  I am trying to reset my circadian rythem and improve sleep quality so I will not feel so fatigued all the time.  Last night was my first night with my flex and on normal mode.  It says I was awakened 14 times and had 6 hr 2 min of sleep out of the 7 hours spent in bed.  Not bad.  Although I was only aware of being awake 4 or 5 times, sometimes the awakenings in fragmented sleep are minor, not  but enough to keep me from getting deep restorative sleep.  I reset it to sensitive mode for tonight and an anxious to compare the results. 

[flguy]

The results between normal and sensitive are wildly different, so it will be interesting to see what you think.  Personally, I confirmed the sensitive setting is the correct one for me.  I've used the data to talk with my doctor.  I am largely focused on Sleep Efficiency at this point.

That is the main number you want to concentrate on or compare to.  Since I started taking a particular prescription med, among other things, I have been able to increase my efficiency from high 60's and low- to mid-70's, to 80's.  Even had a night with 91% efficiency, but haven't been able to achieve that again.  This is all on sensitive mode.

Consistency is key to using your Fitbit properly.  For example, only put it in sleep mode the minute you are actually putting your head down to sleep, and minute you are "awake" in the morning, even if you stay in bed a while longer, otherwise your efficiency will get messed up.  # of awakenings is important, too, but that all plays into efficiency.

I am currently deciding whether the slight bump I get out of the med is worth the potential long term side effects/addiction.  Probably not, but I'm still in the early stages.  That's my story for now (I have made multiple post under this thread).

[Hjane26]

So, just an update on my sleep study results...basically, he said what I thought he would...that the study results were inconclusive.  I told him that I think my anxiety got in the way too much, and I was SO uncomfortable that I didn't think it would accurately depict the issues I have.  He agreed that it didn't give him the data he needed to specify what is wrong with me.  

He still believes it's most likely narcolepsy though, and decided to treat it as such.  Since I have taken all the traditional sleep aids in the past with no luck, he prescribed something to keep me more alert during the day, in hopes that it would help me become sleepier enough to sleep better at night.  I just started it today, and I'm hoping it works after a few days.  I could really use the help concentrating during the day, as my whole life is impacted from lack of sleep night after night!!  He did also of course rule out sleep apnea or anything like that.  I guess we'll just see how this goes...Hope everyone else is finding ways to sleep well 😃

[Devee]

Thank you so much for sharing your challenging problems and your struggle to reach a solution or solutions.

[ceeceham]

Huge difference between normal and sensitive sleep results.  92% efficiency on Normal and only 37% on Sensitive. I am moving around and restless all night...definitely getting very few periods of deep sleep.  Which explains why I sleep for sufficient periods of time but never feel rested.  I will have to work on this.  I think I may need to invest in a better mattress for starters. 

[colin99]

Hi Hjane26, it's a huge challenge. I hope it starts to get better for you. I'm currently doing restorative yoga in the evenings and using a sleep restriction window of 6 hours to try to recalibrate myself. But I definitely feel the lack of energy during the day - some days are almost impossible. Getting some test results back next week - I had a bunch of tests done when I basically had an extremely bad case of exhaustion in March. Of course, all the tests and changing sleep patterns just increases anxiety which makes it harder to sleep!

[michaelfromto]

The results between normal and sensitive are wildly different - for sure!

7-8 hours (normal) and usually 4 hours (sensitive)!

[rgodwin]

Rachel, the first time that I put the Fitbit Flex in to sleep mode, I only had to tap it twice and it vibrated.  For several nights after this, I would tap it twice and just assumed that it was in sleep mode.  Needless to say, my Dashboard showed no sleep activity.  Then I read one of the discussion boards and it stated that many users  have to tap it 6-7 times to get the vibration alert stating that it is in sleep mode.  Very confusing but it works.  

[Mammylau]

I have about 387 restless mins a night is this normal too? I'm always tired. Is this flea telling me something others don't have? It tells me I have approx 3.5 hours sleep a night.

[mamamack]

Mammylau - Do you have your flex set on normal or sensitive?  Just my opinion but, If you are always tired when you are waking up, you may want to talk to your doctor about a sleep study. There are many things it could be, including sleep apnea.  Many things happen when you have sleep apnea -  stopping breathing and not getting enough REM sleep, which is so important to getting the most restful/regenerative sleep.  My sleep study showed that I spent only 4% of my night in REM sleep.  I started using a cpap maching to help.  It took a little getting used to but, really help.  I had a surgery in December to help with this (I also had some other problems as well).  That brought my REM sleep to 17%.  I feel so much better, and will have another sleep study sometime at the end of the year.

[flguy]

REM sleep is when you're dreaming, right?  Because I dream a lot, but don't always feel refreshed afterwards, or the dreams may ocassionally wake me up (nothing strange, just vivid).  This is true whether I am on meds or not.  Although I "think" I get better quality sleep on the meds, Fitbit is proving to be a little inconclusive.  My sleep efficiency can be up or down for lots of various reasons I can think of, not just meds, so I'm haivng a hard time quantifying whether meds are useful (talking OTC or prescription).  Any thoughts on this?

[redd]

Often some meds can cause vivid dreams or even the potential for sleep walking. This may not be your particular situation, but you have to be careful taking sleep meds, especially prescription ones. This can be what's affecting your sleep patterns.

[MarieA]

"During the deep stages of NREM(non-rem) sleep, the body repairs and regenerates tissues, builds bone and muscle, and appears to strengthen the immune system."

This quote from WebMed leads me to believe that NREM is what you want to achieve.

Just a thought.

I have sleep Apnea and use a CPAP machine.  Before I started using it, Fitbit recorded that my sleep was being interrupted a lot.  Now when I use the CPAP machine, I can have as much as 6 hours of NREM, and I feel far better.

[colin99]

Hi MarieA, that gives me great hope! I had a cpap machine prescribed last year and just had such a time with it that I gave up (seems a common thing with these machines). I've been in a sleep program for a few weeks now and am now at 2 weeks of using the cpap machine - amazingly I think I'm now getting used to it. Had a night a couple days ago where I woke up and thought the machine was turned off because I didn't notice it!

My sleep is very broken up with 3 hours total being a good night. I spend almost more time in restlessness than sleeping.

One of the problems I also had was difficulty falling asleep. Sleep restriction and restorative yoga in the evenings has greatly helped that problem (which also helps with cpap since I don't lay awake for an hour now trying to fall asleep).

[Fit_4_Life]

I too have a slender neck and also a small jaw. I am 52 and have apnea. I thought if I lost weight I could ditch the CPAP but after feeling just too tired too long and after seeing my fitbit sleep info, I started the CPAP again. It really helps. That said, it is tough to accept the idea of using a CPAP for life. Are you still using yours?

[Fit_4_Life]

How do you know when you are getting NREM sleep? I am working to improve my immune system and the doc pointed straight to sleep as a first step. I struggle with sleep, recently returning to the CPAP after hoping I wouldn't need it after dropping 20lbs.

[colin99]

Hi Marianne, I think the only real way to determine REM vs NREM sleep is through a sleep study. I'd have to dig up mine from last year to see what they highlighted.

I'm in the same kind of struggle now between getting used to cpap (avoided it as long as I could) and having a rough battle with sleep.

[ceeceham]

I think I need to request a copy of my sleep study.  After suffering from fatigue for years I had a sleep study in May.  I do not have sleep apnea as suspected due to my weight and a family history, but my doctor told me I have "fragmented sleep" and should research good sleep habits online.  When I got my fitbit I slept my first night on normal and was shocked to see 97% sleep efficiency and only a few wakeful periods.  The next night I switched to sensitive and have kept it there ever since.  I average in the 30-40% efficiency with many wakeful periods.  I know there is some debate on the accuracy since fitbit only measures movement but as far as I know the body is still during deep sleep.  The fitbit results seem consistent with how I feel.  I sleep for long periods but don't feel rested.  Other than rolling over and the occasional bathroom trip I am unaware of being awake so much.  I take melatonin, keep a consistent bedtime and awake time, dim the lights at night, all of the "good sleep habits".  But I still rarely make it though a whole day without a nap or feelings of exhaustion.  Wondering what else I can do and thinking if I could review my sleep study I'd have a better idea of how many hours of NREM sleep I am actually getting.

[flguy]

If you want to do your own sleep study at home, my advice is to buy a Dropcam, train it on yourself at night, and measure how many times you move in comparison to what your Fitbit it showing you.  I did that myself and posted the results under a different thread, but this is the gist of it: the Dropcam movement "alerts" lined up almost perfectly with the Fitbit on sensitive setting.

That being said, I am having a hard time using Fitbit to correlate the differences in my sleep patterns between being on prescription meds or not.  Do I do not yet have definitive proof either way that med "x" helps me any better than med "y" or OTC "z".  It could very well be that I'm moving in the middle of the night while completely asleep.  Previously, when the did the test above, I was pretty sure I was awake all those times I was moving.  On meds, I don't think I'm awake as much, yet I still show movements.  Not sure what it all means.  Lately I have been focused on my sleep efficiency number, and using that as a guide.