I Am Convinced That The iPhone GPS Sucks

[bcalvanese]

When I first got the Blaze I had an iPhone 6s Plus and the connected GPS was off by up to a mile some times, but once in a while it would be within a tenth of a mile.

I was not thinking it was the phones GPS back then, just thought it was the Blaze or something to do with the way the tracking was being done. I played around with the stride length, and it seemed to help at first, but then it would go nuts again.

i upgraded to the Galaxy S7, and the connected GPS was within a tenth of a mile every time until an Android upgrade started turning stuff off to conserve battery, then it started freaking out. I found the setting to dissable the location and fitbit being turned off and set them to be on all the time, then it started working good again.

When the iPhone 7 came out i just had to try it (phone junkie), so I upgraded to it. The connected GPS started acting the same way as it did with the 6s Plus that I had. I tried it several times and it only came close once. I had 14 days to return the iPhone, so I returned it and got the Galaxy S7 Edge. Now the connected GPS is back to working great again.

So, I'm convinced that the iPhone GPS just sucks.

Anyone else having similar results?

[bbarrera]

@bcalvanese You did **not** test the phone's GPS

You tested Fitbit's interesting use of Bluetooth to (not always) transfer GPS from phone to Blaze. What do you think happens if your Blaze doesn't get all the GPS trackpoints?

What other devices are connected via Bluetooth to your phone? Have you tried replacing your Blaze?

Fitbit's Connected GPS feature on Blaze and Charge 2 has been repeatedly shown to have distance issues, regardless of phone or OS. Its not universal, doesn't happen to everyone. I've got a friend that rides with a bike computer and her Blaze connected to iPhone 6s. She is a stickler for details. She hasn't had a problem with Blaze connected GPS and iPhone 6s, the Blaze is within 1% of her bike computer.

When there is a problem, the reports on this forum have been for both Android and iPhones. We've even some that humorously show Fitbit's MobileRun correctly report distance but Blaze did not (for the exact same GPS tracked workout!). And another report with Blaze reporting wrong distance, but sync'ing that same activity to Strava results in a correct distance on Strava.

All of this points to communication issues between Fitbit and Android or iPhone. If the Blaze doesn't get all the GPS data, then you won't get full mileage.

I've tested the GPS on all my iPhones, including the latest iPhone 7, and never had an issue using the following:

- Apple Watch (original) Connected GPS with iPhone 5s and iPhone 7

- RideWithGPS

- Strava

- Runkeeper

- Fitbit app's MobileRun

All agree within 1% to my GPS bike computer (or known route, in the case of a walk). My longer RideWithGPS activities (100 mile rides) are done in airplane mode, where all radios except GPS are turned off. For example bike computer 105.2 miles and RWGPS app at 104.4 miles (less than 1% diff), or another century ride with bike at 96.0 miles and RWGPS app at 96.5 miles (less than 1% diff).

The conclusion is undeniable, Fitbit's Connected GPS can be hit or miss, and all signs point to Bluetooth communication issue between phone and Blaze. Replacing one or the other may fix the problem.

Do me a favor, go to the web dashboard, find a "bad" walk or run, and download the TCX file for it. Then send it to me - dropbox, private message, email, or whatever, and also let me know the distance. I'll take a look at it and tell you if there is dropped gps trackpoints, and feed it into a couple tools to calculate distance.

[bcalvanese]

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@bbarrera wrote:

@bcalvanese You did **not** test the phone's GPS

You tested Fitbit's interesting use of Bluetooth to (not always) transfer GPS from phone to Blaze. What do you think happens if your Blaze doesn't get all the GPS trackpoints?

What other devices are connected via Bluetooth to your phone? Have you tried replacing your Blaze?

Fitbit's Connected GPS feature on Blaze and Charge 2 has been repeatedly shown to have distance issues, regardless of phone or OS. Its not universal, doesn't happen to everyone. I've got a friend that rides with a bike computer and her Blaze connected to iPhone 6s. She is a stickler for details. She hasn't had a problem with Blaze connected GPS and iPhone 6s, the Blaze is within 1% of her bike computer.

When there is a problem, the reports on this forum have been for both Android and iPhones. We've even some that humorously show Fitbit's MobileRun correctly report distance but Blaze did not (for the exact same GPS tracked workout!). And another report with Blaze reporting wrong distance, but sync'ing that same activity to Strava results in a correct distance on Strava.

All of this points to communication issues between Fitbit and Android or iPhone. If the Blaze doesn't get all the GPS data, then you won't get full mileage.

I've tested the GPS on all my iPhones, including the latest iPhone 7, and never had an issue using the following:

- Apple Watch (original) Connected GPS with iPhone 5s and iPhone 7

- RideWithGPS

- Strava

- Runkeeper

- Fitbit app's MobileRun

All agree within 1% to my GPS bike computer (or known route, in the case of a walk). My longer RideWithGPS activities (100 mile rides) are done in airplane mode, where all radios except GPS are turned off. For example bike computer 105.2 miles and RWGPS app at 104.4 miles (less than 1% diff), or another century ride with bike at 96.0 miles and RWGPS app at 96.5 miles (less than 1% diff).

The conclusion is undeniable, Fitbit's Connected GPS can be hit or miss, and all signs point to Bluetooth communication issue between phone and Blaze. Replacing one or the other may fix the problem.

Do me a favor, go to the web dashboard, find a "bad" walk or run, and download the TCX file for it. Then send it to me - dropbox, private message, email, or whatever, and also let me know the distance. I'll take a look at it and tell you if there is dropped gps trackpoints, and feed it into a couple tools to calculate distance.

---

I wore my Garmin fenix3 HR on one wrist and my Blaze on the other wrist during this session and recorded both at the same time. The Garmin has built in GPS with GLONASS and is pretty darn accurate (well withing a 10th of a mile).

Below is a screenshot of both tracks...

The same Blaze worked fine on the Galaxy S7 and Galaxy S7 edge, but worked badly on the iPhone 6s Plus and iPhone 7.

Also, on the iPhones when I opened maps, most of the times there was a pretty large blue shaded circle around the location point. I think that indicates that the actual position is within the blue shaded area.

On the Galaxy phones the position marker always seems to pop up and adjust very quickly. I did look at the specs on the Galaxy and it says it has GPS with GLONASS.

I guess it could be the way the iPhone collects the points compared to the Galaxy, but the same Blaze worked great on both Galaxy phones and very poorly on both iPhones.

I tried to send you a private message, but I didn't see any option to attach the file, but just looking at the screenshots you can see that the GPS with the iPhone is crazy.

[bbarrera]

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@bcalvanese wrote:

screenshots you can see that the GPS with the iPhone is crazy.

---

@bcalvanese I wasn't questioning your problem, I was offering to review the raw data collected by your Blaze and analyze it. What if the raw data had large time gaps? Would that convince you that it could be a bluetooth issue and not the phone?

There are a bunch of variables affecting your phone's GPS accuracy, you didn't try using Fitbit app's MobileRun or another app like Runkeeper to determine if you have a phone problem (even then, it could be your phone case, or moisture if no case, or location on body, or something else, or simply a lemon phone).

The iPhone has had GNSS (GPS and GLONASS) since 2011.

Back to my point, lets look at some posts about Connected GPS accuracy issues. Did a generic search for "fitbit blaze connected gps accuracy" - first hit - , found an interesting thread on this forum. Here are the issues reported, along with tests conducted: 

"I, like others, am having accuracy problems with connected GPS exercises. One thing I noticed is the map with the plotted route, using the GPS through the Fitbit app, the plotted line is nice and smooth and looks correct to the path I took. The connected GPS plotted line is very ragged and not straight and smooth. My walk was straight down the road for .25 mile and back. I'm consistently seeing the connected GPS reading .1 miles over every mile. I did the 2 tests back to back, I even did it as a bike ride and same results, ragged route and over on distance. My phone is the Motorola Moto E running 5.0 lollipop and my Blaze has the most current firmware. Does anyone know if this issue is being worked on?"

Phone: Motorola Moto E

Comparison: Blaze Connected GPS vs Fitbit MobileRun on same phone

Conclusion: Phone GPS just fine, Blaze wrong

"I have the same problem, using my Nexux 6P running Android 6.0.1 with my Blaze.  My Blaze using Connected GPS is off all the time.  Sometimes off by as much as 1/2 a kilometer, most time about 100 - 200 meter (about 110 - 230 feet) for a 4.38 km walk.  And my FitBit Mobile Track works perfect, just the Blaze.  I contacted Fitbit and after they tried some things, they send me are placement Blaze and the new Blaze does the same thing.  The problem has to be in the FitBit app or Blaze Firmware.  I am very unhappy with the Blaze and FitBit customer service, they deny there is a problem."

Phone: Nexus 6P

Comparison: Blaze Connected GPS vs Fitbit MobileRun on same phone

Conclusion: Phone GPS just fine, Blaze wrong

"I too am being cheated on distance and steps with the Blaze when comparing their connected GPS to MapMyWalk and even my car. This morning I tracked what Fitbit connected GPS said was a mile on their map and got approximately 1.5 miles on my car."

Phone: Galaxy S6

Comparison: Blaze Connected GPS vs MapMyWalk on same phone

Conclusion: Phone GPS just fine, Blaze wrong

https://community.fitbit.com/t5/Blaze/Connected-GPS-vs-Fitbit-app-GPS-accuracy/m-p/1425834/

All 3 tested by running an app at same time as using Connected GPS. The conclusion is that the phone's GPS was just fine, the problem was the Blaze.

Wasn't trying to pick on Android, easy to find 'connected GPS not accurate' posts from iPhone users too.

On the flip side you can read DCRainmaker review of Blaze and iPhone 6s, he didn't have a problem with distance or pace on a bunch of runs using Connected GPS.

You can't "test" phone GPS by looking at Blaze. If Bluetooth connection is interrupted then Blaze will not have all gps trackpoints and the distance will be wrong (and map may look fine or bad).

[bbarrera]

I'll summarize by starting from the top.

Fitbit admitted to TheVerge there is an issue with Connected GPS accuracy.

Angela a Fitbit employee and moderator stated the Blaze Connected GPS "Sometimes the Blaze looses connection with the phone and this might be why the distance information...

Then lets look at both Android and iPhone users on this Fitbit community that have clearly demonstrated a) phone GPS just fine, and b) Blaze has distance accuracy issues with Connected GPS.

There is the hiking tour company that has hundreds of data points that iPhone doesn't suck.

Finally, this is Apple, if there was a GPS issue then "GPS-gate" would have blown up the Internet. It hasn't happened.

If you would like, I'll gather up all the "Blaze connected GPS is not accurate" reports and give you a master list of "Android and iPhones with sucky GPS" when judged soley by the Blaze. It won't really tell us anything about the phone GPS, because the weak link in the chain is that Blaze assumes a) an uninterrupted bluetooth connection to the phone, and b) that Android doesn't put gps into low power mode (yeah, some people thought the Android phone GPS sucked but it turned out to be an overly aggressive power optimization "feature").

[bcalvanese]

---

@bbarrera wrote:

I'll summarize by starting from the top.

Fitbit admitted to TheVerge there is an issue with Connected GPS accuracy.

Angela a Fitbit employee and moderator stated the Blaze Connected GPS "Sometimes the Blaze looses connection with the phone and this might be why the distance information...

Then lets look at both Android and iPhone users on this Fitbit community that have clearly demonstrated a) phone GPS just fine, and b) Blaze has distance accuracy issues with Connected GPS.

There is the hiking tour company that has hundreds of data points that iPhone doesn't suck.

Finally, this is Apple, if there was a GPS issue then "GPS-gate" would have blown up the Internet. It hasn't happened.

If you would like, I'll gather up all the "Blaze connected GPS is not accurate" reports and give you a master list of "Android and iPhones with sucky GPS" when judged soley by the Blaze. It won't really tell us anything about the phone GPS, because the weak link in the chain is that Blaze assumes a) an uninterrupted bluetooth connection to the phone, and b) that Android doesn't put gps into low power mode (yeah, some people thought the Android phone GPS sucked but it turned out to be an overly aggressive power optimization "feature").

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwOB2bmhofg

[bbarrera]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WcopqGROWs

[bcalvanese]

I dont know what to tell ya...

2 different iPhones (6s Plus & 7), and GPS was off by up to a mile sometimes, and within a 10th of a mile maybe once or twice.

2 different Galaxy phones (S7 & S7 edge), and GPS was within a 10th of a mile 99 percent of the time, and a little more than a 10th of a mile maybe once or twice.

The same Blaze was used for all 4 phones.

Do the math.

[bbarrera]

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@bcalvanese wrote:

I dont know what to tell ya...

---

Well I do know what to tell you... I'm an electrical engineer thats worked with embedded systems my entire career, and have designed chips and written software. The company I work for fixes Android and Linux systems (pre and post production) that are being developed for medical devices, industral control systems, automotive systems, in-flight entertainment systems, consumer electronics, etc, etc. We deal with a lot of driver issues: Bluetooth, NFC, Ethernet, memory devices, etc. We've seen it all.

You tested Bluetooth "Connected GPS" between phone and Blaze. The Blaze has known issues with Connected GPS, you didn't eliminate the primary source of errors in your analysis.

Congratulations, you confirmed that Fitbit's Connected GPS is unreliable, and hit or miss, and can depend on phone and a bunch of other variables. 

You didn't test the phone GPS.

My 2 hour bike ride today:

38.31 miles : Garmin Edge 520 GPS bike computer

38.40 miles : RideWithGPS app running on iPhone 7

38.25 miles : Apple Watch (original) using "connected GPS" to iPhone 7

Baseline: Garmin bike computer

+0.23% error iPhone 7 / RWGPS

-0.16% error iPhone 7 / Apple Watch

Nearly complete agreement between Garmin GPS and iPhone 7.

I'm done, go right ahead and believe your "phone gps test" is unrelated to Fitbit's Connected GPS, a system known to have distance issues on both Android and iPhones.

[bcalvanese]

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@bbarrera wrote:

---

@bcalvanese wrote:

I dont know what to tell ya...

---

Well I do know what to tell you... I'm an electrical engineer thats worked with embedded systems my entire career, and have designed chips and written software. The company I work for fixes Android and Linux systems (pre and post production) that are being developed for medical devices, industral control systems, automotive systems, in-flight entertainment systems, consumer electronics, etc, etc. We deal with a lot of driver issues: Bluetooth, NFC, Ethernet, memory devices, etc. We've seen it all.

You tested Bluetooth "Connected GPS" between phone and Blaze. The Blaze has known issues with Connected GPS, you didn't eliminate the primary source of errors in your analysis.

Congratulations, you confirmed that Fitbit's Connected GPS is unreliable, and hit or miss, and can depend on phone and a bunch of other variables. 

You didn't test the phone GPS.

My 2 hour bike ride today:

38.31 miles : Garmin Edge 520 GPS bike computer

38.40 miles : RideWithGPS app running on iPhone 7

38.25 miles : Apple Watch (original) using "connected GPS" to iPhone 7

Baseline: Garmin bike computer

+0.23% error iPhone 7 / RWGPS

-0.16% error iPhone 7 / Apple Watch

Nearly complete agreement between Garmin GPS and iPhone 7.

I'm done, go right ahead and believe your "phone gps test" is unrelated to Fitbit's Connected GPS, a system known to have distance issues on both Android and iPhones.

---

Dude. no need to get upset.

I did test the iPhone GPS. When there is a very large shaded blue area around the location point, doesn't that mean that you could be anywhere within the blue shaded area?

I should have went on the same walk and watched the map on the iPhone while I was walking. I'd be willing to bet that it would be jumping around sort of like it did on the screenshot i posted.

When navigating in my car at times I would get the same result as in the vidio I posted, but I also know the car can interfier with the GPS signal, so thats not a very good test anyway (although i never had that happen in the car with the Samsung phones).

I am not saying that the Blaze does not have connected GPS issues, but I also think that the phones GPS is a very big factor too. Even if the connected GPS worked perfectly, if the GPS itself is not good it will still cause major issues.

I've had a pretty technical career too. I spent 17 years in industrial maintenance. Electrical, electronics, mechanical, hydraulic, pneumatic, and have also designed electrical and electronic circuits. I made a career change about a decade or so ago and am currently a software developer.

If the same Blaze works good on 2 seperate Galaxy phones, and works poorly on 2 seperate iPhones, what does that tell you?

If you have the knowledge that you claim to have, you could only conclude that even though there may be problems with the connected GPS on the Blaze, the phones GPS plays a very big role in determining the result.

Could I have gotten 2 dud iPhones in a row?

I guess it's possible.

Could I have gotten 2 Galaxy phone that had really good GPS's in a row?

I guess it's possible too.

Everyone is entitled to thier opinion, and this is just mine.

Sorry if I upset you.

[Mack023]

I was facing this issue untill i fixed it by granting location access to the maps app.