Keto anyone?

[Chubbymama]

Hello - I'm new here, first time logging on. I'm just wondering if anyone has done the keto diet and had success? My husband and friends know people who have dropped 20+ pounds on this diet. I've lost 5 in 6 weeks. I'm getting frustrated because I am working so hard to lose another 15.

Does anyone have any tips or suggestions on how to be successful at losing weight while eating healthy and working out? I'm even turning down pizza...and that is hard. I'm doing everything that I can but I'm just not satisfied with the time it is taking me to lose weight.

Thanks in advance!!

[DavidSchneier]

Every diet that works, and I mean every single diet ever, that works, only does so because it creates a consistent calorie deficit. Whether it's a low carb/high protein diet, fast metabolism diet, Weight Watchers.... whatever; it only works because it results in your consuming fewer calories than you burn.

And so, I cut to the chase and simply focused on sticking to a daily calorie budget. I started in earnest in February and lost 65 pounds (most of it was gone in four months). I have continue to lose moderately despite having increased my intake. But I've also increased my activity level and so continue to burn more calories than I consume.

So feel free to rely on something as prescriptive as the keto diet (I'm not a fan, but if it works, it works) or go native and simply cut your calories on your own. My one piece of caution is that when you rely on a diet that restricts what you can eat, you have to eventually reconcile that when you return to eating the foods you enjoy, the weight may follow. For me, I never stopped eating pizza or Chinese food, or even real ice cream, I just enjoyed it in measured amount and manipulated things to I could do so and keep under budget.

[Daves_Not_Here]

Agreeing with @DavidSchneier.  After 5 years at a lower weight, I allowed my lifestyle to degrade and regained my weight.  I figured, no problem, I'll just get back to eating low-carb like before, and the weight should fall off like before.

Wrong.

I screwed around for 3 months reducing carbs and didn't lose an ounce.  It wasn't until I got serious and started logging all my food that things started moving (15 pounds lost in first month).  Ironically, I'm not really keto (my macros are 40/40/20 carbs/fat/protein) but the weight is still coming off fast and easy.  For now.

Here's the routine that works for me:  light cardio 3 days per week, light resistance 2 days per week, 64 oz water daily, 8 hours sleep daily, no eating after 6:00 PM, only one glass of wine or beer per day, 1/4 to 1/2 avocado with every meal, cook meals in batches, minimum bread, rice and sugar, log everything.  This kind of "clean living" leads to lower anxiety, higher energy, and lower appetite which makes it easier to sustain.

[Dominique]

Welcome to the community, @Chubbymama!

Is there a particular reason why you want to lose the extra weight as fast as possible? Like you are the next Bond girl and you need to be in shape before the shooting of the movie? Why not take the time, avoid becoming a yoyo-dieter and making the loss durable?

Since you "only" have 20 pounds to lose, I’ll assume you are in or close to the normal weight range. If so, a suitable pace would be 0.5-1.0% of your body weight per week. Let’s say you’re 160 and want to drop to 140. With the faster pace (1.0%), you would need 15 weeks to reach your goal (average daily deficit 745 calories). With the slower pace (0.5%), you would need 28 weeks (average deficit: 375 calories). 

There is nothing "magical" in the ketogenic diet. As already noted, any diet works if it puts you in a caloric deficit. You just have to find an eating style you can adhere to. The sharp initial drop in weight achieved with low-carb diets (the ketogenic diet being the most extreme variant of low-carb diets) is caused by the fact three grams of water are stored for every gram of carbohydrate eaten: reintroduce carbs, and the water comes back with them.

I understand people are used to overnight deliveries with Amazon, Fedex etc., and they perhaps expect the same should happen with weight loss. However, it’s usually a case of slow and steady wins the race, if you’re interested in long-term success.

[lennythek]

Dave- can you share what calorie level you try to maintain?   I am confused by the numbers i see from the various calorie calculators!!    I am 5'8" and 220- according to last chart i need 2400 just to maintain this weight.   I have been tracking to sub 2000 but not losing weight.

Just curious what you set as the top limit.

Len

[lennythek]

40/40/20 is percentages?

[Dominique]

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@lennythek wrote:

40/40/20 is percentages?

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Probably percentage of total calories. For instance, 2000 calories would be:

carbs: 800 calories (200 grams)

fat: 800 calories (89 grams)

protein: 400 calories (100 grams)

[Daves_Not_Here]

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@lennythek wrote:

Dave- can you share what calorie level you try to maintain?   I am confused by the numbers i see from the various calorie calculators!!    I am 5'8" and 220- according to last chart i need 2400 just to maintain this weight.   I have been tracking to sub 2000 but not losing weight.

Just curious what you set as the top limit.

Len

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On July 7, I was 5'10", 240 lb, 58 years old.  I set a goal to lose 2 pounds a week to get back down to 170, where I was 3 years ago (I had lost weight to get there 8 years ago, and maintained for 5 years ago until I took my eye off the ball and reverted to previous bad habits).  My BMR (Base Metabolic Rate) is around 2,000 calories and with activity, my RMR (Resting Metabolic Rate) is around 2,500.  To lose 2 pounds a week, Fitbit sets me up with a 1,000 calorie deficit target, or 1,500 calories to eat, which I've been able to maintain.  So far, I've lost about 17 pounds in 5 weeks (prior to July 7, I was trying half-heartedly and going nowhere).

The 40/40/20 is fat/carb/protein calorie percentages as indicated in the Fitbit food log.  (Both grams and calorie proportions are indicated).  I am not consciously trying to hit these proportions -- it's just how they are working out -- I only mention the portions to show that you don't have to be extremely low carb to lose weight quickly.  However, having a higher fat portion helps to reduce hunger craving.  Plus, my carbs come from low-glycemic-load sources, which also helps control hunger.  So my 1,500 calorie target is pretty easy to hit and some days I only eat 1,000 calories because my appetite is so suppressed.

I've been doing an experiment -- I am measuring my actual weight loss versus predicted.  I weigh daily and log my consumption like a fiend.  If I steal 1 french fry from my son, I log it.  And what I'm finding is that, after an initial 5 pound water loss, I'm losing 1 pound for every 3,500 accumulated calorie deficit.  Today, my weight is within 1/2 pound of predicted.

If you're not losing, my bet is you're eating more than you think.  Here are the practices I try to follow:

• Log everything as accurately as possible (I have a food scale)
• 8 glasses of water per day
• No eating after 6:00 PM
• 8 hours sleep
• Avoid bread, pasta, sweets, potatoes, rice - get carbs from vegetables & fruit
• Limit fruit in favor of vegetables
• Avoid artificially sweetened drinks - water instead
• Increase fat and protein
• Light to moderate exercise - more important to control appetite and eating

[lennythek]

thanks = appreciate the detailed response- I am in my 60s and this is the first time I have seen somnthing that makes sense.   will try your approach...

Len

[Daves_Not_Here]

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@lennythek wrote:

thanks = appreciate the detailed response- I am in my 60s and this is the first time I have seen somnthing that makes sense.   will try your approach...

Len

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Great!  Thanks for the positive feedback.

[WavyDavey]

I'm just getting off of a keto diet. It's great for weight loss. What it wasn't great with was fueling my workouts. I found out I needed carbs to fuel workouts. In the absence of carbs, my body starting breaking down muscle for fuel.

So now I eat carbs both before and after a workout. They seem to burn easy and my performance has increased. Best of luck.

[Daves_Not_Here]

I'm having a similar experience.  When I know I'm going to have strenuous activity, I'll reduce my calorie deficit and increase carbs in the day prior and for a recovery meal.  Then, I'm back to reducing carbs to suppress my appetite.  It seems to work well for me; although, I don't think I go into ketosis.

I also think this tends to function as a "cheat day" to keep my metabolism up.

[ARcycler17]

I have generally been living a ketogenic lifestyle since March of 2016 and have found the experience transformative. I lost 30 lbs (174 to 144 lbs) in the first six months and have been able to stay within one or two lbs of 144 since then. I will tell you that I do not feel I am truly ketogenic; I have done a lot of reading on the lifestyle and continually refine my intake. I took the change seriously from the start and used a great book by Dr. David Perlmutter, Grain Brain, as a great foundation and inspiration. At the start I totally eliminated all grains, processed sugars, and high-glycemic fruits and vegetables; I also focused on trying to get 70% of my calories from healthy fats. 

I have done tons of google searches on the lifestyle and feels that the reading was key to my success; this is not something to enter casually. You need to learn how to listen to your body and pay attention to your sodium, potassium and magnesium intake to avoid negative side effects. Something as simple as a cup of organic chicken broth a few times a week to supplement your sodium could be the difference between success and failure. 

I just finished a book by Dr. Joseph Mercola, Fat For Fuel, which is well worth the read. Even after all of my reading and research, it was informative and encouraging. 

Every individual is different; from the time I started, this felt natural. I never experienced frustration and I feel that the difference was knowledge about the lifestyle. I used to eat pretty well, but always struggled with cravings for sugars and carbohydrates. On this ketogenic lifestyle, I feel more focused, sleep better, have no cravings for carbohydrates and have seen dramatic improvement in my fasting glucose and triglycerides. I could go on but will leave it there for now.. 

Best of luck to you!

[lennythek]

Can you describe what the first couple weeks was like?

also interested in how you prepare for a workout or athletic event?

len

[ARcycler17]

When I first started the diet, I cut back on the intensity and distances on my bike rides. I could definitely notice the diminished energy level, but after about three months, I was back to normal rides. I am a cyclist who typically logs 85-100 miles per week in three rides. This June, I completed a 104.5 mile ride in 6 hr 21 mins and felt great after the ride and on the next day had no tired feeling. I strongly believe that fat is a cleaner fuel for endurance exercise. While low glycogen stores may limit bursts, I had plenty of energy at the end of my ride. 

I will be 60 later this month and also survived a heart attack in 2006 with 100% blockage in my right coronary artery. I have always been health conscious but did not pay close enough attention to my cholesterol levels. Since my heart attack, I have managed my cholesterol well with Lipitor, but I still found myself carrying extra weight (particularly in the winter months). On the ketogenic diet, I have cut my statin in half and even with the change in dose, my levels have never been better; in fact, my HDL cholesterol is higher than my LDL. My triglycerides dropped to 54 and my typically borderline pre-diabetic fasting glucose is now below 80. My primary care physician was skeptical at first but has conceded that this lifestyle works well for me. 

If you read the books I mentioned, you will see the physiological basis for why this works.

I am still working on my pre-ride food intake. I drink chicken broth with coconut oil; have eggs with irish butter and broccoli or spinach; I get an ounce of macadamia nuts or pecans; I have also worked in some 85% cacao chocolate . I try to make sure that the nuts and eggs are a few hours before the ride.

I have heard of people experiencing low energy or keto flu in the first few weeks of the diet, but I never had any really negative side effects. I never got below 1800 calories per day during the diet and now average 2300-2400 cals per day to maintain my weight. On days with long rides, I try to keep my intake within 1000 calories of output. One thing I have leaned to avoid is rushing too many fat calories at once. I try to pace my fat intake. 

I am committed to this lifestyle and plan on learning more about how to make it work even better. I have dropped body fat, but want to focus on maintain muscle mass that is so critical as we age. Too much protein is just as bad as too many carbohydrates; there is a balance involved that allows us to maintain muscle; that is what I am looking to maximize.  

Hope this helps.

[Daves_Not_Here]

@ARcycler17 - Very informative post - thanks!  104 miles in 6:21 is a blistering pace and out of my league for sure - I'm lucky to finish a century under 8 hours.  I'm experimenting with keto and exercise and trying to wean myself off of high sugar sports drinks in favor of water while cycling.  This weekend I ate a low carb breakfast, got 1.5 hours into a 4 hour ride and almost bonked.  I stopped, had a bowl of grits which brought me back from the brink and I was able to finish.

What's your recommendation on how I can get past this tendency to bonk when my glycogen stores are so low/non-existent?  Also, do you feel you can climb as strongly now that you are acclimated to keto?

[Dominique]

FWIW, Precision Nutrition (a company that has a lot of good content about all things nutrition) has a Special Report on Low Carb and Ketogenic Diets. It’s a 6-part series covering the following items:

• The pros and cons of low carb diets.

• Do ketogenic diets live up to the hype?

• The pros and cons of a Paleo-type diet.

• Stories (and data) from a low carb convert.

• Finding the best diet for you (or a client).

• How to fix a broken diet and get your eating on track.

You need to give them an e-mail address in order to receive each part. The first part on the pros and cons of low carb diets is a 23-page PDF available here (I included the direct link so you can have a look at it before deciding whether it’s worthwile getting the rest). I personally found it interesting.

[LiquidAmber]

I've restarted by LCHF lifestyle recently.  I am using MyFitnessPal to count calories and macro nutrients...  I am targeting 75% fat, 20% protein and 5% carbs.  So far I have lost 2 lbs in ~1 week.  I am walking daily, targeting 9k steps per day.

What I love about this lifestyle is that I feel great.  My mind is clear and I perform better at work.  I don't have the perpetual cravings all day.  It is liberating.

I recommend that you track what you are eating.  This is what helped me move the needle in my weight loss too.

[Dominique]

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@LiquidAmber wrote:

My mind is clear and I perform better at work. 

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The mind clarity thing is mind-boggling, given that the brain is exclusively fueled by glucose. "Brain fog" + keto is also a very popular search on Google.

OTOH, intermittent fasters also often say the same thing, whereas science points to the fact the brain performs a lot better in a fed state than in an unfed state.

Well, we all have to find out what works best for us.

[Daves_Not_Here]

@Dominique - I continue to hear two sets of anecdotes as to mental clarity and keto:

1. There can be an initial period of fog lasting 1 to 2 weeks
2. For those who persist though the fog, there is increased mental clarity

The people I know who have been successful in sticking with it are very enthusiastic.  They feel they are better able to stay on task than before, do not become mentally fatigued towards the end of the day, sleep better, feel younger, etc.

My problem is that I can't afford to take two weeks off to be dumber than I currently am to find out if it will work for me.