07-14-2015 18:21
07-14-2015 18:21
10-26-2017 11:33 - edited 10-26-2017 14:38
10-26-2017 11:33 - edited 10-26-2017 14:38
@Red_Pomegranate wrote:"A keto diet can improve some markers of type 2 diabetes, but it will likely never eliminate the need to take medication. A keto diet will cause many other health problems."
@GershonSurge, flatly untrue, I suggest you do your research before you go spouting off somewhere your input isn't desired.
Google Dr Sarah Hallberg and watch her Ted talk, for a start.
I no longer concern myself with other people's diets. Thank you for your input. It seems a keto diet causes people to turn nasty.
10-26-2017 16:21
10-26-2017 16:21
@GershonSurge if speaking plainly makes me "nasty" then I am happy to be considered a nasty woman 😊 there are many of us.
If you don't follow diets why are you asking us to follow yours? Contradiction much?
10-27-2017 17:28
10-27-2017 17:28
@GershonSurge - Not trying to stoke a controversy or debate with these questions (I appreciate how heated dialog is largely absent from the Fitbit Community).
You had mentioned that keto will cause many other health problems -- what are these many other health problems? Can you point us to published evidence of these many problems?
You had mentioned that "a keto diet can improve some markers of type 2 diabetes, but it will likely never eliminate the need to take medication". But Virtahealth is treating type 2 diabetes with ketogenic diets and many of its patients have indeed eliminated the need to take medication, according to their results at https://www.virtahealth.com/research . Is there reason to believe these results are falsified? Can you point us to contrary evidence published elsewhere?
These questions are sincere -- I try to understand all sides of an issue. In the case of keto, I'm having an overwhelmingly positive experience with it so far, but I want to make sure that I am not blinded by it and my own confirmation bias. By the way, I don't doubt that people do well on plant-based diets as recommended by Pritikin and McDougall.
10-28-2017 01:15
10-28-2017 01:15
I no longer discuss ways of eating. All I am willing to do is point people in the direction of solid research.
I suggest starting with this series of videos by Dr. McDougall.
Then read The Starch Solution by Dr. McDougall. He has many links to studies. Click on the links and read every study that is on the internet.
Dr. T. Colin Campbell has been researching ways of eating for over 60 years. I suggest starting with Whole: Rethinking the Science of Nutrition. Also, read The China Study. Keep in mind The China Study is a collection of data, not an actual research study. However, it confirms other research studies done by Dr. Campbell.
After reading these books, I suggest listening to about 100 of these videos by Dr. Campbell. I did it while walking and working out. You will learn how flawed much of the research is and how influenced it is by meat and dairy industry.
I suggest listening to the Pritikin tapes from 1982. The reason to go back this far is you will see the information hasn't changed in decades. It has been confirmed by numerous studies since then.
Then read A REVIEW OF MEDICAL LITERATURE ON RELATIONSHIPS OF VARIOUS DEGENERATIVE DISEASES TO DIET AND ACTIVIT... by Nathan Pritikin. This will point you to earlier research.
Yes, it's a ton of reading and listening. I've done it all and much more. Enjoy.
10-28-2017 11:42
10-28-2017 11:42
Thanks @GershonSurge for such a comprehensive compendium of resources. It will take me some time to get through them.
The question I'm trying to answer is not whether plant-based diets are beneficial (I believe they are), but if keto is harmful and does not enable some with type 2 diabetes to get off their medications, which is your contention. I'm curious if any of the links you provided support that position?
I've been intrigued by reports that Pritikin's protocols enable patients to reverse their cardiovascular disease and "unclog" their arteries.
10-28-2017 12:34
10-28-2017 12:34
You can find all the answers to all dietary health questions in those sources. It wouldn't be helpful to point you directly to your question. That would be a reductionist approach which does not work for healthy eating.
10-30-2017 20:52
10-30-2017 20:52
@GershonSurge - that's pretty funny -- I'll have to try that if I ever make an unsupported allegation and somebody calls me on it: "Well, I could answer your question, but instead I'll bury you in a barrage of answers to a different question."
So no, not only does my "reductionist" approach work for healthy eating, it's good for flushing out intellectual frauds and sophists.
You said you "no longer discuss ways of eating" but assert "keto will cause many other health problems". Putting aside that keto is a way of eating that you are discussing, your attempted obfuscation of your inability to cite evidence or example is not fooling anybody.
Your unsupported allegation that keto "will likely never eliminate the need to take medication" in the face of direct evidence to the contrary betrays a hidebound lack of curiosity.
To assert that "all the answers to all dietary health questions" are even known much less provided by you, reveals either arrogance or misunderstanding of the word "all".
Not sure what you are trying to accomplish here in your condescension, because it certainly isn't to influence or persuade.
11-01-2017 02:27
11-01-2017 02:27
Everything you posted supports and encourages a vegan lifestyle but that does not suit everyone. Truth is, starches makes a lot of people extremely ill which is why so many people are now following a ketogenic lifestyle. I can't speak for @Daves_Not_Here but I can say that transitioning to a ketogenic lifestyle (which I have now sustained for well over two years) has resulted in drastic improvements in my health, energy levels, and physical conditioning, and I am connected to many others who have had the same results.
I've read the China Study. I've also read various reports that completely discredit it - for that you'll have to do your own research as I just read and move on, I don't save references. For whatever study you drag up to try and use as evidence for the vegan approach you appear to be pushing, if you actually dig deeper you'll find other studies that disprove and discredit accordingly.
People should be left to find what works for them personally without being pushed by others who prefer to do things differently and no one has any right to repeatedly tell others that their way of doing things is wrong, which is what you have been doing in this topic.
11-01-2017 03:14
11-01-2017 03:14
First of all, this thread started in 2015, and I made only one post in July 2017. That's hardly "pushing" a way of eating and it's hardly repeatedly. The other posts were in response to others who are basically calling me a liar.
@Daves_Not_Hereasked some specific questions. I pointed out I don't debate ways of eating anymore, so I gave him some admittedly long research to do. At first, he thanked me for them, and then he viciously attacked me for no reason.
If you want to eat keto, go ahead. I'd rather go with the old guys who say differently and have been doing so since they started their work in the early 70s.
Gershon
11-01-2017 11:39
11-01-2017 11:39
@GershonSurge and @Daves_Not_Here
Might I suggest that the two of you take your argument elsewhere?
I think it's clear this thread was intended to be a supportive environment for those of us that wish to follow a keto / LCHF eating strategy.
I for one have no intention to engage in a debate. I've already decided it works for me, and I am happy to support others who are interested and want to try it.
It's my choice (any anyone else's). Nothing either of you say will persuade me to change what I have found to be immensely successful.
12-03-2018 11:47
12-03-2018 11:47
Great to hear... that’s my dream!
12-03-2018 11:59
12-03-2018 11:59
Thank you for the help & excited to have keto pals & mentors! I’m 2 weeks in & still trying to eat enough fats. Counting on my Fitbit and a little confused with grams of each vs calorie %. Anyone have that dialed in? Which should I count, percent calories or actual grams?
So far I miss pancakes & my roasted carbs veggies, but down +7lbs! Luckily I like Asparagus and broccoli/cauliflower. Love feeling so satisfied and full all day!
Favorite travel snacks anyone? So far lots of nuts... other ideas?
Thank you,
Heather : )
12-03-2018 12:26
12-03-2018 12:26
12-04-2018 06:27
12-04-2018 06:27
12-04-2018 06:35
12-04-2018 06:35
12-04-2018 10:22
12-04-2018 10:22
Thanks @SunsetRunner - those look yummy! I'll make the pepperoni muffins this week.
My one Keto food problem is I have not found any good substitute to satisfy my desire for crunch or bread. The Keto bread recipes I've tried have all been uniformly awful. Have you found any that work?
12-04-2018 10:30
12-04-2018 10:30
12-04-2018 11:19
12-04-2018 11:19
12-04-2018 15:09
12-04-2018 15:09
I crunch on roasted almonds or kale chips. Pretty good, but I miss bread & chips too!
The pepperoni pizza cups cups look yummy... TY!
04-02-2019 10:08
04-02-2019 10:08
Can you make a copy and make this shareable on open office? Or google docs? I wouldn’t mind playing around with it for my own records.
If you don’t mind 😊